Zeke Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Falaffel said: You can vote for neither. True. I can just write in Giant meteor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, Zeke said: Anyways, why should a black/Native American should get up in the morning to the polls to vote for either shitlord? This sounds like a joke that needs a snappy punchline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, Zeke said: True. I can just write in Giant meteor Or a legitimate third party. But, I mean... Giant meteor works too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeke Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, Saxon said: Why did the OP tag Berlusconni in? Because Bernie is like...Mussolini? 1 minute ago, Falaffel said: Or a legitimate third party. But, I mean... Giant meteor works too. Technically I am registered as Independent, so I could toss it out to one of those shmoes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Falaffel said: Or a legitimate third party. But, I mean... Giant meteor works too. You can always vote Libertarian. Or just light your vote on fire or throw it in the garbage. Either way it's the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, #00Buck said: You can always vote Libertarian. Or just light your vote on fire or throw it in the garbage. Either way it's the same thing. With that attitude, it might as well be. You're the problem here. :3 I mean, if you were actually American. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeke Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Saxon said: Berlusconi was a former Italian prime minister, who was legendarily corrupt, was divorced by his wife for 'consorting with minors' and eventually chased out of office, convicted of tax fraud and made to do community service in lieu of a prison sentence. Oh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 It's kinda weird how half of america is independent yet no 3rd party has won an election in a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Falaffel said: With that attitude, it might as well be. You're the problem here. :3 I mean, if you were actually American. I have already visited America. After I left America became a sad and awful place. The only way America will be great again is if I come and visit or if Trump gets elected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 6 minutes ago, Falaffel said: With that attitude, it might as well be. You're the problem here. :3 I mean, if you were actually American. Your vote means NOTHING. The presidency is determined solely by the vote of the 538 electors of the electoral college. They have no legal obligation to abide by anyone's interests but their own. This is the real face of the nation you live in. The face of democracy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 10 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said: Your vote means NOTHING. The presidency is determined solely by the vote of the 538 electors of the electoral college. They have no legal obligation to abide by anyone's interests but their own. This is the real face of the nation you live in. The face of democracy. Life also means nothing. Let me think I'm making a difference pls :c 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, Falaffel said: Life also means nothing. Let me think I'm making a difference pls :c 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 hour ago, #00Buck said: Please back up your comment with some peer reviewed studies. Otherwise I refuse to accept your argument. Ok I would rather not clutter up this entire thread with videos and books to provide you with a near complete understanding of the field of logic so if you want I can PM them too you. I will however try a short demonstration of why here. Ok first off a logical argument is composed of two primary parts the premises that support the argument and the conclusion one is attempting to draw from it. Arguments can be broken down into individual pieces in order to more easily analyze them. Your argument was very simple so it will be easy to demonstrate it in a pure logical format. Ok first off you have A(or premise 1) which is that people can vote for Trump. Then you have B(or the second premise) which is that voting for Trumps makes people whimper like little bitches. These then lead into C(or the conclusion) which is that people should vote for Trump. Which leaves us with this(Note these are not the correct symbols one would actually use in a logical argument most keyboards along with most text entry programs lack these symbols) A + B = C The problem with your argument then comes from the fact that logic is transitive meaning that if any thing else meets the same premises then it necessitates the same conclusion. If you want to avoid your argument applying to any individual that meets the qualifications then you are going to have to expand your argument with further premises. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Derin Darkpaw said: Ok I would rather not clutter up this entire thread with videos and books to provide you with a near complete understanding of the field of logic so if you want I can PM them too you. I will however try a short demonstration of why here. Ok first off a logical argument is composed of two primary parts the premises that support the argument and the conclusion one is attempting to draw from it. Arguments can be broken down into individual pieces in order to more easily analyze them. Your argument was very simple so it will be easy to demonstrate it in a pure logical format. Ok first off you have A(or premise 1) which is that people can vote for Trump. Then you have B(or the second premise) which is that voting for Trumps makes people whimper like little bitches. These then lead into C(or the conclusion) which is that people should vote for Trump. Which leaves us with this(Note these are not the correct symbols one would actually use in a logical argument most keyboards lack those symbols text entry programs lack these symbols) A + B = C The problem with your argument then comes from the fact that logic is transitive meaning that if any thing else meets the same premises then it necessitates the same conclusion. If you want to avoid your argument applying to any individual that meets the qualifications then you are going to have to expand your argument with further premises. That is not a peer reviewed study. You have not presented any studies to prove your point. You and your argument are invalid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 7 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said: Give us Ze Money Lebowski. My Girlfriend she cut off her toe. It's not fair! 1 minute ago, Saxon said: Is this discussion about transitive logic serious? Sometimes you eat the bar and sometimes the bar eats you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 2 minutes ago, Saxon said: Is this discussion about transitive logic serious? No Buck is just attempting to paint some picture of me as a hypocrite. He has done in the past and he is doing it now. I assume he is relegated to such shallow and disingenuous argument tactics because he has demonstrated in the past his inability to argue effectively or honestly and its beginning to catch up with him. As usual however I will not pass up a teachable moment to help educate others in regards to more effective techniques for constructing arguments and critical thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Saxon said: Buck isn't trying to paint you as anything. He is joking. Obviously nobody wants to read peer reviewed literature about why Donald Trump sucks. Exactly. I just let people paint themselves however they choose. If people want to maintain a good self image they should really put their own brushes down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 4 minutes ago, Saxon said: Buck isn't trying to paint you as anything. He is joking. If the only reason you have for voting for a candidate for President of the United States is a joke then I believe one should seriously reconsider their priorities. I am still waiting for any one to provide actual reasoning for why one should vote for Trump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Derin Darkpaw said: If the only reason you have for voting for a candidate for President of the United States is a joke then I believe one should seriously reconsider their priorities. I am still waiting for any one to provide actual reasoning for why one should vote for Trump Pretty sure Buck can't even vote, mate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Falaffel said: Pretty sure Buck can't even vote, mate. Also correct! Gotta love the way people paint themselves in here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, Falaffel said: Pretty sure Buck can't even vote, mate. However that doesn't stop his voice from affecting people who can. The fact that he as an individual can not vote in this election does not mean that his actions are incapable of influencing it. @Saxon dangerous misinformation needs to be countered through sound reasoning it should not simply be ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Derin Darkpaw said: However that doesn't stop his voice from affecting people who can. The fact that he as an individual can not vote in this election does not mean that his actions are incapable of influencing it. Being absolutely fair, if people take what Buck has said here seriously, they are far from smart individuals and can't be helped. ;3c 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 Just now, Falaffel said: Being absolutely fair, if people take what Buck has said here seriously, they are far from smart individuals and can't be helped. ;3c I firmly believe that everyone can be helped and that no one is beyond hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Falaffel said: Being absolutely fair, if people take what Buck has said here seriously, they are far from smart individuals and can't be helped. ;3c Most certainly. Besides I would have used the "serious" tag to indicate serious posts were serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, Derin Darkpaw said: However that doesn't stop his voice from affecting people who can. The fact that he as an individual can not vote in this election does not mean that his actions are incapable of influencing it. @Saxon dangerous misinformation needs to be countered through sound reasoning it should not simply be ignored. It seems I have heard this before 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 1 minute ago, Derin Darkpaw said: I firmly believe that everyone can be helped and that no one is beyond hope. fwoosh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 2 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said: It seems I have heard this before *raises arm at 45 degree angle* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 42 minutes ago, Saxon said: Maybe Derin is also only pretending and both of them are wasting their time. Oh, my time has not been wasted. This is great entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 ITT: People forget Buck is not serious sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toshabi Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 8 hours ago, Saxon said: Essentially @Derin Darkpaw you should probably just add Buck to your ignore list. Obviously there are reasons that people want to vote for Donald Trump. Not everybody will agree that they are good reasons, but it's useful to view things from other people's perspectives once in a while. For example his promise to place a moratorium on Muslim immigration to the United States appeals to Americans who lost friends and family in terrorist attacks such as 9/11, and who feel spurned that they are castigated as xenophobes for being weary of the religion, in whose name their nearest and dearest were slaughtered. I don't agree with that reasoning, but you can understand why some people would. Nigel Farage? Is that you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LazerMaster5 Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 The internet in one picture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wax Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/20/donald-trump-assassination-attempt-las-vegas-rally A British lad has attempted to assassinate Donald Trump, apparently. I can forsee more attempts on his life if he gets into office, to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 3 minutes ago, Wax said: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/20/donald-trump-assassination-attempt-las-vegas-rally A British lad has attempted to assassinate Donald Trump, apparently. I can forsee more attempts on his life if he gets into office, to be honest. UK is a cucked nation. This is to be expected. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wax Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 1 minute ago, #00Buck said: UK is a cucked nation. This is to be expected. Not really. There's 'cucks' in pretty much every nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 2 minutes ago, Wax said: Not really. There's 'cucks' in pretty much every nation. UK is cucked the worst. I have peer reviewed studies that prove it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osrik Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 1 hour ago, Wax said: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/20/donald-trump-assassination-attempt-las-vegas-rally A British lad has attempted to assassinate Donald Trump, apparently. I can forsee more attempts on his life if he gets into office, to be honest. This election is reminding me more and more of Wiemar Germany... while the candidates are not as extreme (though they are extreme when compared to America's past), the supporters tend to have a lot of the same motivations (mostly fear for their and the country's future), many of the same political strategies are being employed, and the election is increasingly seeing clashes between supporters of different candidates. While the situation is certainly nowhere near as bad as in Wiemar Germany, I think this turn to extreme candidates (again, I am not calling anyone Hitler, Trump uses a lot of the same strategies and language but is nowhere near as extreme in actual policy) is certainly an indication of some serious issues within the American political system and population that again in some ways mirror Wiemar Germany. There is a wide perception that the country is in a period of decline, the economy is struggling and many are facing unemployment or underemployment, and there is an almost universal feeling that the government no longer represents the interests of the people. The United States is thus currently in a dangerous situation, where people are more willing to latch on to easy answers rather than real solutions, leading to the great popularity of demagogues like Trump, who pose a real threat to a democratic country. I expect these candidates will continue to be popular even if Trump is defeated, until the government sees major changes.that correct the many problems perceived by the populace. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hux Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 7 hours ago, Saxon said: I said I didn't agree with the reasoning. I'm just trying to show Derin that there are lots of other perspectives and that people do have their reasons, even if they're reasons I don't like. Other people's perspectives are dangerous and should be controlled. Don't you get it, Saxon? You're, like, totally fascist or something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derin Darkpaw Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 23 hours ago, Saxon said: Essentially @Derin Darkpaw you should probably just add Buck to your ignore list. Obviously there are reasons that people want to vote for Donald Trump. Not everybody will agree that they are good reasons, but it's useful to view things from other people's perspectives once in a while. For example his promise to place a moratorium on Muslim immigration to the United States appeals to Americans who lost friends and family in terrorist attacks such as 9/11, and who feel spurned that they are castigated as xenophobes for being weary of the religion, in whose name their nearest and dearest were slaughtered. I don't agree with that reasoning, but you can understand why some people would. Yes I understand that some people may have reasons such as the above to support Trump, but that doesn't mean those reasons should go unexamined. Also just because they currently hold a certain set of beliefs that is no excuse to assume that they are incapable of listening to sound reasonable arguments and that they may come to change those beliefs. For example in regards to the situation above I would explain that a moratorium on Muslim immigration would do next to nothing to stop terrorists from carrying out plots against the United States. We can not check for the religion of potential immigrants because there is no way to accurately test that and individuals that wished to do harm would in all likelihood simply lie in order to gain access to our country anyway. Then if instead of based on religion you are denying people based on race that won't stop people who have been radicalized by terrorist organizations that happen to be members of other races. The only thing such a moratorium will definitely accomplish is to prevent individuals that would bring a positive contribution to our country who just happen to be members of a certain race or that wish to openly display themselves as members of a certain religion. 3 hours ago, Hux said: Other people's perspectives are dangerous and should be controlled. Don't you get, Saxon? You're, like, totally fascist or something. Not controlled mind you but no ones perspective is immune to criticism or exempt from being the subject of sound reasonable debate. Also @#00Buck Don't worry I too find our little exchanges rather entertaining if this wasn't fun I would have stopped a long time ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalletFace Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 13 hours ago, Osrik said: The election is increasingly seeing clashes between supporters of different candidates. This turn to extreme candidates is certainly an indication of some serious issues within the American political system and population... There is a wide perception that the country is in a period of decline, the economy is struggling and many are facing unemployment or underemployment, and there is an almost universal feeling that the government no longer represents the interests of the people. The United States is thus currently in a dangerous situation... leading to the great popularity of demagogues like Trump, who pose a real threat to a democratic country. I expect these candidates will continue to be popular even if Trump is defeated, until the government sees major changes.that correct the many problems perceived by the populace. Happens regularly. There was right after the Revolution when people were actively taking over government buildings because of it. There was that time in the 1830s when people threatened to revolt because of it. It happened again after the 1860s when people were attempting to sabotage the government because of it. It also happened during the Great Depression when people did all of the above again. Ditto from the '70s to the '90s. I think the government is actually beginning to improve in how it handles this repetition, though. Where we got Douglass MacArthur organizing a charge of the 12th Infantry, the 3rd Cavalry, and a handful of tanks against unarmed veterans demanding their pay in the '30s, we get the local police pepper-spraying protestors demanding change today. Ain't that wonderful? Come to think of it, MacArthur was really close to being president. Despite the sarcasm just now, Trump is less dangerous than MacArthur. Some joke about Trump creating problems as POTUS, but MacArthur actively tried - and nearly succeeded several times - at starting a third World War. Many of his supporters wanted him to become president so he could start a war with the USSR and (later) the PRC. He was not the only candidate like that. I feel an outright "I will start WWIII" being absent from every major campaign since 1980 is an actual improvement. Not saying I support Trump, but he ain't close to the worst. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WileyWarWeasel Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 18 hours ago, Osrik said: There is a wide perception that the country is in a period of decline, the economy is struggling and many are facing unemployment or underemployment, and there is an almost universal feeling that the government no longer represents the interests of the people. Fortunately we know that such perceptions are false. Obama said so: :V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osrik Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 9 hours ago, MalletFace said: Happens regularly. There was right after the Revolution when people were actively taking over government buildings because of it. There was that time in the 1830s when people threatened to revolt because of it. It happened again after the 1860s when people were attempting to sabotage the government because of it. It also happened during the Great Depression when people did all of the above again. Ditto from the '70s to the '90s. I think the government is actually beginning to improve in how it handles this repetition, though. Where we got Douglass MacArthur organizing a charge of the 12th Infantry, the 3rd Cavalry, and a handful of tanks against unarmed veterans demanding their pay in the '30s, we get the local police pepper-spraying protestors demanding change today. Ain't that wonderful? Come to think of it, MacArthur was really close to being president. Despite the sarcasm just now, Trump is less dangerous than MacArthur. Some joke about Trump creating problems as POTUS, but MacArthur actively tried - and nearly succeeded several times - at starting a third World War. Many of his supporters wanted him to become president so he could start a war with the USSR and (later) the PRC. He was not the only candidate like that. I feel an outright "I will start WWIII" being absent from every major campaign since 1980 is an actual improvement. Not saying I support Trump, but he ain't close to the worst. While there have previously been similar periods of political unrest within the United States, this does not mean that such periods aren't dangerous. I think that this election indicates we are entering such a period of increased political radicalism and possibly violence, but as of now it is impossible to tell how long it will last or end, with this mostly depending on if change is made in the government or alternatively if public perceptions of the government change. As to Trump, I look at him more as a symptom of the problem rather than the problem itself. While I agree that he is not the worst we have seen, he is by definition a demagogue, and the wide popularity of even a demagogue of less than extreme political stance is a serious danger to any political system, as it shows that people are easily susceptible to broad appeals to their hopes and prejudices rather than rational arguments and specific plans. The real danger of Trump is what he shows of the wider political climate, for if people are willing to support one demagogue this election, whose to say they will not in the future support a demagogue of even more extreme political leanings? Anytime a demagogue is able to reach mass popularity within a democratic political system, that is when vigilance is needed, as that is when democracy often falls. It happened in ancient Athens, it happened in Germany, and it is my opinion that it could happen to any democracy under the right conditions. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 The only violence recently is from Anti-Trump protesters and islamic terrorists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaraphayx Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 On 6/21/2016 at 6:08 AM, Saxon said: I said I didn't agree with the reasoning. I'm just trying to show Derin that there are lots of other perspectives and that people do have their reasons, even if they're reasons I don't like. And I'm just trying to teach you how to post better, why don't you stop taking it so hard? :3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CETME Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 On June 20, 2016 at 1:43 PM, Zeke said: Anyways, why should a black/Native American should get up in the morning to the polls to vote for either shitlord? Other than getting paid leave by the city to vote? Or you can try Gary Johnson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Put Trumps name in chalk in the safe space. Watch the triggering begin. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 Trump is a honey badger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toshabi Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 7 hours ago, #00Buck said: Put Trumps name in chalk in the safe space. Watch the triggering begin. This seriously makes me wish I was a college student again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 1 minute ago, Toshabi said: This seriously makes me wish I was a college student again. If I was a college student again I'd be troll level over 9000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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