#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 I've been changing a lot lately. The issue is that I've been changing back. I'm turning into the person I was a long time ago. I'm even changing physically into that person. When it comes to change most people think different is better. Different is forwards. This is historically a step backwards in time. I don't really know if it's bad or good. The person I was back then had a much worse life than I do now. Would you feel okay if you changed into the person you used to be? Or would that be a step backwards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelwell Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Uh depends how far back we're going. 9-10 months ago would be practically a leap forward in most aspects. Although I suppose I've matured a bit. : / People are always changing, sometimes it's dramatically over a short period of time. You don't know if you'll end up the person back then, or if it just seems like it. If you don't like a change, change it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 5 minutes ago, Feelwell the Rabbit said: Uh depends how far back we're going. I'm going back 15 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelwell Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, #00Buck said: I'm going back 15 years. I take it that's not going back to the future then? I mean most people would love to feel younger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Feelwell the Rabbit said: I take it that's not going back to the future then? I mean most people would love to feel younger. Oh I'm looking and feeling younger alright. However, it seems to be causing a whole lot of problems and the change only seems to be accelerating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelwell Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, #00Buck said: Oh I'm looking and feeling younger alright. However, it seems to be causing a whole lot of problems and the change only seems to be accelerating. Ah, we need to break out the big guns. Purchase a cane and a plaid cap, dye any facial hair completely white and scream at young children. If its causing problems, see if you can adapt these changes to, cause less problems. I mean the nature of the problems are pretty vague. You'd know the situation best. Don't fight changes, but don't let them get the best of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Feelwell the Rabbit said: Ah, we need to break out the big guns. Purchase a cane and a plaid cap, dye any facial hair completely white and scream at young children. If its causing problems, see if you can adapt these changes to, cause less problems. I mean the nature of the problems are pretty vague. You'd know the situation best. Don't fight changes, but don't let them get the best of you. Actually it is going with the changes that's causing the most problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Are you okay with reverting back to your old self? Does it scare you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, Enigma said: Are you okay with reverting back to your old self? Does it scare you? I didn't even realize I was reverting until someone listed off all the things I've been doing and said that I've never done any of those things before. I corrected them that I used to do all of them constantly. Even I had forgotten what I used to be like. It isn't scary although some of the consequences suck. Although if it is a negative thing it would be a bummer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelwell Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, #00Buck said: Although if it is a negative thing it would be a bummer. Its whatever you make of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Feelwell the Rabbit said: Its whatever you make of it. Well other people have a say in it too. If my friends and other people don't like it then that sucks too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, #00Buck said: I didn't even realize I was reverting until someone listed off all the things I've been doing and said that I've never done any of those things before. I corrected them that I used to do all of them constantly. Even I had forgotten what I used to be like. It isn't scary although some of the consequences suck. Although if it is a negative thing it would be a bummer. If it isn't harming anyone and you have no regrets about your actions then I would say keep doing it. But the fact that you mentioned this means there is a hint of regret in your actions. Either nip it in the bud or continue to do the better parts of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 7 minutes ago, Enigma said: If it isn't harming anyone and you have no regrets about your actions then I would say keep doing it. But the fact that you mentioned this means there is a hint of regret in your actions. Either nip it in the bud or continue to do the better parts of it. The change isn't something I'm "doing." It's just happening. I can't really control much of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, #00Buck said: The change isn't something I'm "doing." It's just happening. I can't really control much of it. You have the power to control it. You're strong Buck, if you don't want to be your old self then don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Enigma said: You have the power to control it. You're strong Buck, if you don't want to be your old self then don't. It's very hard to fight nature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, #00Buck said: It's very hard to fight nature. It is, but you have friends to help you. You're not in this alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastryOfApathy Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 I won't pretend to know what you were like 15 years ago and whether or not it's as bad as you think. But if you need to talk, just know I'm more than willing to help in any way I possibly can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Enigma said: It is, but you have friends to help you. You're not in this alone. Oh, if my old friends knew about the extent of the changes they'd stop being my friends. My new friends only know the new me so I'm not sure they'd understand what I'm going through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelwell Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Oh by the way. If they're bad habits, or if they're a facet of this, you could try this site. https://habitica.com/ Its also an app. Basically helps you break bad habits, remember to do daily things, and build good habits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, PastryOfApathy said: I won't pretend to know what you were like 15 years ago and whether or not it's as bad as you think. But if you need to talk, just know I'm more than willing to help in any way I possibly can. Thanks! You're sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 2 minutes ago, #00Buck said: Oh, if my old friends knew about the extent of the changes they'd stop being my friends. My new friends only know the new me so I'm not sure they'd understand what I'm going through. If your old friends gave up on you so easily they weren't your truly friends. Let your new friends in, let them help you be the best version of yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastryOfApathy Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, #00Buck said: Thanks! You're sweet. I don't see why it's so special. You're my friend Buck, so I want to make sure you're as happy as you can be in any way I can. That's what friends are for right? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Just now, Sylver said: this thread is so gay If being there for someone is gay, I don't want to be straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 Might be gay soon. Who knows? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 5 minutes ago, #00Buck said: Might be gay soon. Who knows? Talk to me Buck. Pm me or talk to me on discord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrishaCat Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 44 minutes ago, #00Buck said: I didn't even realize I was reverting until someone listed off all the things I've been doing and said that I've never done any of those things before. I corrected them that I used to do all of them constantly. Even I had forgotten what I used to be like. It isn't scary although some of the consequences suck. Although if it is a negative thing it would be a bummer. The fact that someone pointed it out to you and that you're actively noticing it as a problem is a good thing though! It means that you have friends who will tell you if somethings off, and it means you can actively work at fixing them and make sure to avoid old bad habits! Knowing what you're doing wrong is one of the first steps in fixing such problems! 1 hour ago, #00Buck said: Would you feel okay if you changed into the person you used to be? Or would that be a step backwards? I often feel as if I've regressed over time as a person. Not as in becoming like how I used to be, but rather becoming worse off over time. I used to be super goody-goody and have this sense of innocence about me. I'd take everything seriously and try my hardest to be as perfect as I can possibly be, as it was my goal to strive to be perfect. I'd avoid even cursing online and would adamantly diss porn of any kind. I would avoid ever making a rude remark and would try to get others to do the same. If people were actively lying to my face, I would pretend I didn't know and take it all at face value and try my best to act and speak as if I believed them, as I felt that it was wrong to doubt others. I'd actively seek out what I perceived to be injustices online just so I could "fight" them and try to get people to see my way and end these injustices. I'd also try my hardest to cheer people up when they were down and help any way I can with people's problems. As time as passed and after a few events elsewhere, I began to just let go and relax and not so much care about the little things anymore. I became more willing to curse and indulge, and I've found myself speak rudely sometimes. I don't go looking for people committing "wrongdoings" and don't make such an effort to help others as I used to. If someone seems to be lying, I actually treat it as a possible lie. I feel like I've regressed in some ways. I miss that "innocence" that I had. I feel I'm lazier and I don't treat people as I should at times. In some ways, I think becoming the person I used to be would be beneficial. I certainly feel I was a lot happier back then. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strongbob Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Do not fear change. The wisdom you have have now from the leasons you have learned will shape who you can be. There is no fate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 5 minutes ago, Strongbob said: Do not fear change. The wisdom you have have now from the leasons you have learned will shape who you can be. There is no fate. Change is good, but reversion is like... the complete opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucyfish Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 9 years ago I was a completely different person. I wasn't Lucy, I was Tommy. Tommy was, in every fundamental way, a completely different person who happened to live in the same body I have now. When I stopped taking my ADHD medication and I began to view the world in a different way, a new person was born. I'm that person today, and if I could go back, the one thing I would change is I would have kicked those ADHD meds a lot sooner so Lucy could have been born at a much younger age. Tommy was horrible. A bad person. The kind of person I would get in a fight with today. I may not be very great even today, but I am much better than the person I once was. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strongbob Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 33 minutes ago, Enigma said: Change is good, but reversion is like... the complete opposite. Yes but change is inevitable and reversion is only one of many choices. Just the fact that Buck is considering the implementations of reverting suggest he is not tied to that fate alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 12 minutes ago, Strongbob said: Yes but change is inevitable and reversion is only one of many choices. Just the fact that Buck is considering the implementations of reverting suggest he is not tied to that fate alone. 56 minutes ago, Strongbob said: Do not fear change. The wisdom you have have now from the leasons you have learned will shape who you can be. There is no fate. What are you on about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamedog Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Me no want change back into me before Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastryOfApathy Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 2 minutes ago, Gamedog said: Me no want change back into me before YEAH! ...I think. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrishaCat Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 5 minutes ago, Enigma said: What are you on about? He's been playing a bunch of JRPGs 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jtrekkie Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 A piece of glass, polished and treated with murcury, so man may look and see what he's become. The mirror is a dangerous thing. You could become blind to it and fill the glass with phantasy, or, like Narcissus, you could fall in love with the image and starve. If you do neither of those, you may watch yourself age, but you can direct the process. Perhaps you slipped backwards because you weren't looking. When I look into the mirror I see a poor image. A child, foolish and uncertain. And I do not know that either he nor I can judge the other. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamedog Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Buck in sorry if you don't mind me asking and you do not have to answe but is this change more of a personality change rather than a previously-changed-but-reverting-back PHYSCAL change? it is easy to avoid reverting if it's the former i am not knowledgeable enough in the latter to offer good advixe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossa Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 2 hours ago, #00Buck said: The change isn't something I'm "doing." It's just happening. I can't really control much of it. Huh, there is a mental condition, where people actually revert to how they were as a child, I believe. Are you in danger of reaching the diaper stage again? This could get messy, and expensive. Seek help at once, before you're sucked back into the womb, and into the void, a sperm and and egg, waiting to meet! Not sure how old you are, but I always have imagined about 25, so that would make you 10? If this is the case, what was reverse puberty like? Or maybe you are more like 30, and now feel 15? ~ But on a serious note, hope ya feel better, and I'd see somebody about this, if its reverting back to an unhappier state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falaffel Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 I've also been reverting to my old self. However, my old self was someone who was confident, fun, happy, and really flirty. I've not been that in a while and I'm feeling that part of me growing again. I'm making no attempt to change like this; the change is just happening. That said, I don't think that's what this thread is about. It's far to vague and barren of any actual content. I still have not figured out the point of these effort post threads Buck does. They never truly say anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revates Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 I've found that in the last year I've had an extremely large amount of personal growth and change, but not reverting back to my old self. Although I don't know how to comment on your situation since there's not enough context, but I personally would find it scary going back to olde me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 i wish you the best, fishman dont do anything i wouldnt do 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 11 hours ago, Endless/Nameless said: i wish you the best, fishman dont do anything i wouldnt do Actually I'm doing a lot of things a lot of people wouldn't do. To give more context I've gotten to a point in my fitness where I've lost 35 pounds and my body is radically changing shape. Specifically my face is now changing back to how it used to look. 15 Years ago I actually worked at a gym and was incredibly fit. Also from the workouts my body is getting flooded with testosterone which is greatly altering my mood, emotions, and decision making. I'm acting exactly the same way I did 15 years ago and I think most of it is hormonally based. I think I'm also making more pheromones as I can just stand next to an attractive female and she will walk over and talk to me or start touching me. I've actually had several young women invite me back to their apartments for sex after talking with me for less than five or ten minutes. These are women who approached me and started talking to me out of nowhere. One of them was in a subway station of all places. These were university students and seemed very healthy and fun. I still have to lose about another 40 pounds to hit my ideal weight but that is kind of inevitable at this point. I can't really stop my fitness routine as my doctor has warned me that without improved health I will die. So for me it's testosterone and endorphins every day no matter what. The problem is most people seem really resentful of these changes. I think I'm going to lose a lot of my old friends from this. I don't think they like the old me very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 9 minutes ago, #00Buck said: Actually I'm doing a lot of things a lot of people wouldn't do. To give more context I've gotten to a point in my fitness where I've lost 35 pounds and my body is radically changing shape. Specifically my face is now changing back to how it used to look. 15 Years ago I actually worked at a gym and was incredibly fit. Also from the workouts my body is getting flooded with testosterone which is greatly altering my mood, emotions, and decision making. I'm acting exactly the same way I did 15 years ago and I think most of it is hormonally based. I think I'm also making more pheromones as I can just stand next to an attractive female and she will walk over and talk to me or start touching me. I've actually had several young women invite me back to their apartments for sex after talking with me for less than five or ten minutes. These are women who approached me and started talking to me out of nowhere. One of them was in a subway station of all places. These were university students and seemed very healthy and fun. I still have to lose about another 40 pounds to hit my ideal weight but that is kind of inevitable at this point. I can't really stop my fitness routine as my doctor has warned me that without improved health I will die. So for me it's testosterone and endorphins every day no matter what. The problem is most people seem really resentful of these changes. I think I'm going to lose a lot of my old friends from this. I don't think they like the old me very much. wear furry ears and carry dakimakuras of ponies then no one will talk to you But in all seriousness, you can't control all circumstances. Normally one would say just quit doing the workouts then, but if it really is a serious health issue that's obviously not a highly viable option. If you do end up pissing people off or losing friends due to facts of your existence, then tough shit for them. However, we can control our actions. If you find yourself doing something objectionable and you know it, blaming it on workouts is not an excuse. Control yourself. Respect yourself. Build yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaende Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 19 hours ago, #00Buck said: I've been changing a lot lately. The issue is that I've been changing back. Clean that dirty laundry before wearing those clothes again, and you should be good to go. Change is good, but we're still ourselves at the end of the day. Embrace that fact. Own it. Keep the good, get rid of the bad, and do it better this time around. You should benefit from having perspective now that you didn't have back in the day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamedog Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 As long as you are not turning into a dick I can't imagine people will care id they do, they weren't good friends to begin with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 hour ago, Endless/Nameless said: wear furry ears and carry dakimakuras of ponies then no one will talk to you But in all seriousness, you can't control all circumstances. Normally one would say just quit doing the workouts then, but if it really is a serious health issue that's obviously not a highly viable option. If you do end up pissing people off or losing friends due to facts of your existence, then tough shit for them. However, we can control our actions. If you find yourself doing something objectionable and you know it, blaming it on workouts is not an excuse. Control yourself. Respect yourself. Build yourself. Hormones are very powerful. It isn't an excuse it's just biology. Ask anyone who has an excessive amount of hormones running through their body. Anyone who remembers their teenage years and the crazy changes that took place can attest to this. I'm just overall different all the time now. There isn't really any controlling it. It's a 24 hour a day difference that can't be shut off. I have more energy. Period. I can't make myself feel lethargic. I just have to get off the couch and go out and do things. I've tried. I just end up bounding off the couch and out the door. I can't sit still all the time anymore. Not possible. I'm working out a minimum of 6 days a week doing weightlifting. I can exhaust myself working out but my energy just comes back an hour later. I'm also horny all the time. I can't make that stop. Well, I can but you know not in a public place or anything. This is probably one of the biggest changes and has the most impact on my daily life. I never used to think about sex very much but now it is pretty much constantly on my mind. I'm more attractive to other people. What am I supposed to do about that? Start dressing like a homeless person? Stop bathing so I smell bad and people avoid me? When I'm out in public and a cute girl spontaneously starts to talk to me and touch me that isn't my fault. Plus I have to take the subway and be in public places sometimes. I'm not a hermit I have a job and stuff. I'm more aggressive in even the smallest ways. I find myself reacting to things faster and more decisively in all situations. I don't mean aggressive as in angry but as in being the first to act or do something when the opportunity presents itself. I can't control any of these things any more than I can control my need for water, food, and sleep. I'm biological which is the part that is frustrating. I really don't have a lot of control over how I'm reacting to things. I eat tons of food now. I could try and eat less but then I walk around hungry/angry and snap at everyone I meet which was what happened when I kept to a strict diet. It's like a bunch of emotions and feelings have been turned up to ten when they used to be set at three or four. This is exactly how I used to be all the time in the past. Now it is in my present in a world that was built by a person who was a lot less of all of these things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, #00Buck said: Hormones are very powerful. It isn't an excuse it's just biology. Ask anyone who has an excessive amount of hormones running through their body. Anyone who remembers their teenage years and the crazy changes that took place can attest to this. I'm just overall different all the time now. There isn't really any controlling it. It's a 24 hour a day difference that can't be shut off. I have more energy. Period. I can't make myself feel lethargic. I just have to get off the couch and go out and do things. I've tried. I just end up bounding off the couch and out the door. I can't sit still all the time anymore. Not possible. I'm working out a minimum of 6 days a week doing weightlifting. I can exhaust myself working out but my energy just comes back an hour later. I'm also horny all the time. I can't make that stop. Well, I can but you know not in a public place or anything. This is probably one of the biggest changes and has the most impact on my daily life. I never used to think about sex very much but now it is pretty much constantly on my mind. I'm more attractive to other people. What am I supposed to do about that? Start dressing like a homeless person? Stop bathing so I smell bad and people avoid me? When I'm out in public and a cute girl spontaneously starts to talk to me and touch me that isn't my fault. Plus I have to take the subway and be in public places sometimes. I'm not a hermit I have a job and stuff. I'm more aggressive in even the smallest ways. I find myself reacting to things faster and more decisively in all situations. I don't mean aggressive as in angry but as in being the first to act or do something when the opportunity presents itself. I can't control any of these things any more than I can control my need for water, food, and sleep. I'm biological which is the part that is frustrating. I really don't have a lot of control over how I'm reacting to things. I eat tons of food now. I could try and eat less but then I walk around hungry/angry and snap at everyone I meet which was what happened when I kept to a strict diet. It's like a bunch of emotions and feelings have been turned up to ten when they used to be set at three or four. This is exactly how I used to be all the time in the past. Now it is in my present in a world that was built by a person who was a lot less of all of these things. You're right, we don't have any control over hormones etc and the effect they have on us. If that's all the issue is, a change in attitude and lifestyle, than oh well. Own your body. If others can't live with that, that's just the way it's gonna be. But if it's actually causing shitty behavior, this is just a wall of excuses. I want to trust you know that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, Endless/Nameless said: You're right, we don't have any control over hormones etc and the effect they have on us. If that's all the issue is, a change in attitude and lifestyle, than oh well. Own your body. If others can't live with that, that's just the way it's gonna be. But if it's actually causing shitty behavior, this is just a wall of excuses. I want to trust you know that. Yeah, but what exactly is shitty behaviour? That's totally subjective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endless/Nameless Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, #00Buck said: Yeah, but what exactly is shitty behaviour? That's totally subjective. if you gotta ask, it probably is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#00Buck Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 minute ago, Endless/Nameless said: if you gotta ask, it probably is. I don't have to ask. I choose to ask out of consideration for the people around me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saxon Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 I'm confused, because when I began reading the opening post I thought it would be a diary entry about relapsing into bad habits, but it actually almost sounds like you're complaining that exercise made you more attractive and virile. Surely this is all good? If other people are frustrated with your self betterment then that's their problem; they should be glad that you're feeling healthier and better in yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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