RICH PEOPLE

[Brass]

4 minutes ago, Rassah said:

I believe Putin's 88% approval rating is about as real as the 97% vote to secede in Eastern Ukraine. Putin was elected, but elections in Russia are always questionable, and the party rules with an iron fist. The figurehead might change, but the same party with the same people is always in charge.

You're just mad because Putin hates the gays and doesn't want them ruining his country, ya homo

[Pignog]

38 minutes ago, Rassah said:

As he types this from a nice air conditioned home, on an affordable computer or electronic device, using a globally interconnected communications platform. 

As I type from a publicly funded library. I am thankful for the craftsmen who built my apartment and the army of labourers for the other stuff though.

 

[Rassah]

6 minutes ago, Brass said:

You're just mad because Putin hates the gays and doesn't want them ruining his country, ya homo

I seriously saw this text, and swear I saw Ashley's name and icon as the Author. My brain is starting to fuck with me. It's way late. Good night.

[Terminal7]

 I come here to escape - I repeat : ESCAPE - the harsh war that is the educational system..

 

Oh my God,  I'm using big words. 

Somebody kill me now. 

[Half-Note]

9 minutes ago, Rassah said:

I believe Putin's 88% approval rating is about as real as the 97% vote to secede in Eastern Ukraine. Putin was elected, but elections in Russia are always questionable, and the party rules with an iron fist. The figurehead might change, but the same party with the same people is always in charge.

By theway, it may interest you to learn that Norway is in many ways more capitalist than US. Most Scandinavian countries are. If you just look at their free services, you might think that's a weird thing to say, especially with Scandinavian countries being darling examples of social liberals, but if you look at the overall tax, regulatory, and business environment, US businesses only wish they could be as "socialist" as Scandinavia...

I assumed you might bring up Crimea. >.> Should've seen it coming.

Crimea was apparently inhabited by a vast majority of foreign national Russians (which may have impacted relations between Ukrainians and Russians in the area in a positive way). Given the take-over of Ukraine by Nazi Ukrainians following the former pro-Russian president fleeing, I do support the annexation of Crimea as it was apparently done democratically, and though the 97% figure might be exaggerated (like most pro-ourselves cases), I do believe that a majority of Crimea wanted to be returned to the Russian Federation, given the situation with the Nazi party.

I also didn't realize Scandinavia was so capitalist. I do know we have a vast amount of oil wealth, given the trade, at least in Norway, but I'm capitalistic too, so I do not mind the country being as well, as long as they do provide enough socialistic elements to give everyone a reasonable way of becoming valuable assets to the society as a whole.

As for elections in Russia being questionable, ANY election is ALWAYS questionable. And I do agree, the one party being constantly in charge is a bad thing, though they have managed to raise the GDP quite a lot (until it plummeted again thanks to international butthurt over Russians not staying inside).

[Brass]

7 minutes ago, Rassah said:

I seriously saw this text, and swear I saw Ashley's name and icon as the Author. My brain is starting to fuck with me. It's way late. Good night.

Come on dude I'm nothing like her. Ashley is sexualy attracted to animal children. I'm a functional adult. 

[Half-Note]

24 minutes ago, Brass said:

You're just mad because Putin hates the gays and doesn't want them ruining his country, ya homo

Not sure if joking, but politics are srs bsns, so I'll go ahead and say that Putin is not anti-gay. Gay relationships and homogender activity is actually legal, just not marriage and propaganda. First being because churches are entitled to their beliefs and if they want to say "send the fags to Hell" then so be it. Second I fully agree with. Fucking obnoxious faggots like myself flailing their dicks around in giant parades to tell everyone just how "normal" they are is ick. >.<

[Brass]

1 minute ago, Half-Note said:

Not sure if joking, but politics are srs bsns, so I'll go ahead and say that Putin is not anti-gay. Gay relationships and homogender activity is actually legal, just not marriage and propaganda. First being because churches are entitled to their beliefs and if they want to say "send the fags to Hell" then so be it. Second I fully agree with. Fucking obnoxious faggots like myself flailing their dicks around in giant parades to tell everyone just how "normal" they are is ick. >.<

tell that to all the fags he's genocided  

[Half-Note]

4 minutes ago, Brass said:

tell that to all the fags he's genocided  

Psht.

[Brass]

Just now, Half-Note said:

Psht.

 

[Half-Note]

47 minutes ago, Brass said:

 

I'll have you know he respects them according to your "free" press.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8xSZ9Fr4c0

Edited December 11, 2015 by Half-Note

[Rassah]

I didn't bring up Crimea, Russia still had no right to annex it, and Putin made up the entire "Nazis in Ukraine" thing. Ukraine is less Nazi than even Britain.

On the other hand, public display of affection can be considered spreading gay propaganda in Russia and get you arrested, gays are routinely harassed and assaulted in Russia and when the police arrives they always arrest the gays for instifating it with their gayness, freedom of speech doesn't exist there, the government owns directly or controls and pays for indirectly all the media in the country, the church has an enormous influence on the government to the point where they are working together 50/50 in a sort of theocracy, corruption is rampant with government officials including Putin stealing $200 billion a year from people, and Russia has more Nazis than any other country in the world, literally possessing HALF of the entire world's Nazi population.

[Brass]

7 minutes ago, Rassah said:

I didn't bring up Crimea, Russia still had no right to annex it, and Putin made up the entire "Nazis in Ukraine" thing. Ukraine is less Nazi than even Britain.

On the other hand, public display of affection can be considered spreading gay propaganda in Russia and get you arrested, gays are routinely harassed and assaulted in Russia and when the police arrives they always arrest the gays for instifating it with their gayness, freedom of speech doesn't exist there, the government owns directly or controls and pays for indirectly all the media in the country, the church has an enormous influence on the government to the point where they are working together 50/50 in a sort of theocracy, corruption is rampant with government officials including Putin stealing $200 billion a year from people, and Russia has more Nazis than any other country in the world, literally possessing HALF of the entire world's Nazi population.

I don't see any problem with any of this. 

[Toshabi]

This thread.

 

[Cingal]

BURN THE RICH. FEED THEM TO THE POOR.

 

THEN BURN THE POOR AND FEED THEM TO THE POORER.

[ZorroValdez]

I need a new car. THROW ME SOME BILLS.

[AshleyAshes]

7 hours ago, Rassah said:

Money can bring happiness.

All studies show that those with wealth experience no more happiness than those who simply have sufficient income to be financially secure, housed, well fed, clothed, and a reasonable level of luxury/entertainment items.  So why is everyone who is wealthy failing to be more happy than everyone else who is 'merely' financially secure by all measures?

[PastryOfApathy]

1 hour ago, AshleyAshes said:

All studies show that those with wealth experience no more happiness than those who simply have sufficient income to be financially secure, housed, well fed, clothed, and a reasonable level of luxury/entertainment items.  So why is everyone who is wealthy failing to be more happy than everyone else who is 'merely' financially secure by all measures?

I always figured it was a thing where the fact that the rich have more things that could potentially make them happy, is balanced out by the fact that it's much easier to become bored and it's harder to find 'genuine' people to get close to.

[Guest]

14 hours ago, Brass said:

That remark cuts me deep. 

Fear not. I got band aids

[Half-Note]

8 hours ago, Rassah said:

I didn't bring up Crimea, Russia still had no right to annex it, and Putin made up the entire "Nazis in Ukraine" thing. Ukraine is less Nazi than even Britain.

On the other hand, public display of affection can be considered spreading gay propaganda in Russia and get you arrested, gays are routinely harassed and assaulted in Russia and when the police arrives they always arrest the gays for instifating it with their gayness, freedom of speech doesn't exist there, the government owns directly or controls and pays for indirectly all the media in the country, the church has an enormous influence on the government to the point where they are working together 50/50 in a sort of theocracy, corruption is rampant with government officials including Putin stealing $200 billion a year from people, and Russia has more Nazis than any other country in the world, literally possessing HALF of the entire world's Nazi population.

 I assumed you were pointing in that direction. Russia, as you say, had no right to annex Crimea, just like no other nation has the right to interfere in the interests of others nor take away their freedom (as long as it does not threaten them or their allies). So I agree, the annexation was, in my opinion, no more rightful than the occupation of Iraq by USAF, though I'd say it is more "politically correct" (not as in using safe words, but actually the best political choice that could've been made under the circumstances), as the annexation was done through a local, public and democratic vote.

As for Putin making up the Nazi boogeyman, it's actually true. No, the entire Ukraine is not Nazi, but a party called Svoboda (formerly known as the Social-National Party of Ukraine, I don't know which is worse, a National Socialist or a Social Nationalist?), quickly gathered support following the former President fleeing to Russia, and at one point in 2014, members of this party were actually part of the First Yatsenyuk Government, which later lost support and ended up being abolished later that same year.

As for gay rights, yes, I agree with you. Gays should have legal protection against discrimination, perhaps even a social contract (like partnership), but not marriage, as I believe churches that follow a set of beliefs should be allowed to follow these ideals without what opposes the religion of the church making an attempt at forcefully becoming a part of it.

When it comes to the church influence, the church is both powerful and independent due to separation of church and state, which means that what the church says, will be heard, though given this separation, the government CAN make laws the church opposes as long as it does not directly affect them, and given that there are many Republican-equivalent heads of state, the laws that the church disagrees with are less likely to be passed. Moving on to corruption, this is rampant EVERYWHERE. Yes, there are bad apples in the Russian Federation's Government, the United States' Government, even the government of some hippie village in the middle of the California desert is bound to have corruption (though stealing millions of dollars in funds makes Hell of a more of an impact than taking a few more apples than what you were allowed to have, unless the hippies will starve because of that monstrous act). As for Putin stealing $200 billion a year and Russia having more Nazis than any other country in the world, I don't find these claims believable. "Why?", do you ask? Well, I will explain in a little song I wrote.

Across the sea, a Bearing one you see
There was a land of hicks and goofs
They'd chant "USAUSAUSAUSAUSA"
Fill the room with loud noise to the roof

"But they're not Nazis!" you say
Well listen to me here today!
They think they're the greatest,
The best and the biggest
We call them the USA

A nationalist country, yeah it is quite so
Claim it's patriotism but that's a lie you know
"ma' country's duh greatest, unless yer' an atheist!"
Oh how they've stooped so low!

"But they're not Nazis!" you say
Well listen to me here today!
They think they're the greatest,
The best and the biggest
We call them the USA

They hate helping others
They fight for themselves
A free-for-all, a social Hell
Switch Capitalism with Socialism
And they'll become Nazis themselves!

"But they're not Nazis!" you say
Well listen to me here today!
They think they're the greatest,
The best and the biggest
We call them the USA

Thank you for reading my art.

And you are free to say whatever you want in Russia! You even get an exciting visit from a very special man in the night who'll make sure you'll sleep very well. ^w^

And unlike most other "civilized" countries, Russia has enough capability of empathy to provide Euthanasia for people leading miserable lives, like journalists and opposing politicians.

Edited December 11, 2015 by Half-Note
typo fix

[Rassah]

2 hours ago, AshleyAshes said:

All studies show that those with wealth experience no more happiness than those who simply have sufficient income to be financially secure, housed, well fed, clothed, and a reasonable level of luxury/entertainment items. 

Those with wealth are also able to provide "sufficient income to be financially secure" for others. Those assets the wealthy used are typically capital that is used by others to be able to make their income as well.

And those studies do set the bar pretty high, showing that you do need quite a bit of money to reach the happiness plateau. Most people are not financially secure (one job loss from getting screwed), and can't afford luxury/entertainment items (how so you scientifically measure a "reasonable amount" BTW?). Best way to measure wealth is "How long can you survive on what you own if you didn't have a job?" For most people out there (like 90% of the population) it's less than two weeks. Ideally the answer should be "indefinitely."

2 hours ago, AshleyAshes said:

So why is everyone who is wealthy failing to be more happy than everyone else who is 'merely' financially secure by all measures?

How many wealthy people do you actually know, being able to make that claim? Everyone I know who is wealthier than I am, like serious millionaires and billionaires, are always pretty damn happy every time I met them or hang out with them in private.

[Guest]

Oh this still going? Derailed too. How'd you go from talking about rich people to the Crimean War? Don't bother answering, I don't actually care, assuming any of you were even considering to do that in the first place hahahaha

[Half-Note]

5 minutes ago, Amiir said:

Oh this still going? Derailed too. How'd you go from talking about rich people to the Crimean War? Don't bother answering, I don't actually care, assuming any of you were even considering to do that in the first place hahahaha

Rich people are linked to the economy, the economy is linked to politics, the politics are linked to the Crimean War.

We've only moved three topics away from the main topic. We're still technically on topic.

[Guest]

I see. Fair enough I guess

[Half-Note]

10 minutes ago, Rassah said:

How many wealthy people do you actually know, being able to make that claim? Everyone I know who is wealthier than I am, like serious millionaires and billionaires, are always pretty damn happy every time I met them or hang out with them in private.

But                                                         alone...

                                                                 In                                             the                              
                         darkness...

                                            The                                          tears                                       come

 streaming                                               down

[Rassah]

The Svoboda party in Ukraine isn't actually Nazi, and it won about 1% of support across the whole nation. That is less than right nationalist parties get in UK, France, and Spain (you want to see real Nazi party progress, look at Greece). Russia did make up the Nazi scare, and even got busted for it. Everyone knew Svoboda and Nazis were pretty much irrelevant, but Russia was pumping them as a big threat. Then when elections came, Russia actually hacked Ukrainian voting system and installed a virus that would give the Nazi candidate a winning score. Ukrainian secret service discovered the virus, removed it, but didn't tell anyone about it. And when elections came, Russian news reported the Nazi supposedly winning with that exact same percent that the virus would have given him, when in reality he was getting a 1% vote. Look it up, there are probably still YouTube copies around.

Russia doesn't have a separation of church and state. The church has a very strong influence on the state, and gets it to pass its morality laws all the time. That's why gay is banned there, among other things.

Regarding Nazi numbers in Russia, Russia has a few Nazi publications and magazines. Their local subscriber numbers add up to half of the world's Nazis. Wiki has a good article on that.

3 minutes ago, Half-Note said:

But                                                         alone...

                                                                 In                                             the                              
                         darkness...

                                            The                                          tears                                       come

 streaming                                               down

I see them when they're hyped up on truth serum (drunk in bars).

[Rassah]

BTW, Half-Note, sorry, but I don't feel like getting into the whole free market capitalist VS socialist-capitalist debate (the topic you brought up earlier). If you're really curious about my position and arguments, this relatively short audio book pretty much covers it, and has the ideas I would be using to defend my side. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aUAIaWTAZs

[Zeke]

 

 

6 hours ago, AshleyAshes said:

All studies show that those with wealth experience no more happiness than those who simply have sufficient income to be financially secure, housed, well fed, clothed, and a reasonable level of luxury/entertainment items.  So why is everyone who is wealthy failing to be more happy than everyone else who is 'merely' financially secure by all measures?

That doesn't matter, because happiness can buy anything! Even friends! If those friends leave you, then you can just buy more! :V

[Half-Note]

10 minutes ago, Rassah said:

The Svoboda party in Ukraine isn't actually Nazi, and it won about 1% of support across the whole nation. That is less than right nationalist parties get in UK, France, and Spain (you want to see real Nazi party progress, look at Greece). Russia did make up the Nazi scare, and even got busted for it. Everyone knew Svoboda and Nazis were pretty much irrelevant, but Russia was pumping them as a big threat. Then when elections came, Russia actually hacked Ukrainian voting system and installed a virus that would give the Nazi candidate a winning score. Ukrainian secret service discovered the virus, removed it, but didn't tell anyone about it. And when elections came, Russian news reported the Nazi supposedly winning with that exact same percent that the virus would have given him, when in reality he was getting a 1% vote. Look it up, there are probably still YouTube copies around.

Russia doesn't have a separation of church and state. The church has a very strong influence on the state, and gets it to pass its morality laws all the time. That's why gay is banned there, among other things.

Regarding Nazi numbers in Russia, Russia has a few Nazi publications and magazines. Their local subscriber numbers add up to half of the world's Nazis. Wiki has a good article on that.

I'll have you know Russian media has brain-washed me and because of that I refuse to believe such perversions of the truth.

The Svoboda party is National-Socialistic. That is Nazism. Fair enough, they may not have had the building plans for the gas chambers presented to the public yet, but it is an ultranationalist party, so they certainly grow on the same trees, just not the same branch. I did find a reference to the cyber-attack you mentioned, but nothing linking the Russian gov't to it. It may have been a pro-Russian/anti-Ukrainian who did it, for all I know.

Following the USSR anti-church campaign, the separation of church and state is an actuality. If it was a border-line theocracy, as you implied earlier, I think there'd be harder punishment for homosexuality than just limitation to ridiculous behavior too.

As for numbers of subscribers to neo-Nazi publications, I believe the number to be much lower, as it is likely, if they are as radical as you say, that they would possibly subscribe to multiple magazines. Does this mean it's fine? No, but it means the number is much lower.

 

 

20 minutes ago, Rassah said:

BTW, Half-Note, sorry, but I don't feel like getting into the whole free market capitalist VS socialist-capitalist debate (the topic you brought up earlier). If you're really curious about my position and arguments, this relatively short audio book pretty much covers it, and has the ideas I would be using to defend my side. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aUAIaWTAZs

But I love debating you. :C

Also, if you're gay, I'd love to marry you and kill you in your sleep to inherit all your wealth. <3

[Brother Attallios]

THE FRUSTRATION OF CITIZENS HERE IS UNDERSTANDABLE, FOR THEY FEEL THEIR LIVES ARE BUT NUMBERS ON A SCREEN, GRAINS OF SAND BETWEEN THE FINGERS OF THOSE EXCEPTIONAL FEW THAT HAVE ESTABLISHED THEMSELVES TO A POSITION OF AUTHORITY. BUT LEARN THEIR PLACE THEY MUST, FOR THEY ARE THE COGS IN A GREATER MACHINE THAT IS THE IMPERIUM OF MAN.

[Half-Note]

6 minutes ago, Brother Attallios said:

THE FRUSTRATION OF CITIZENS HERE IS UNDERSTANDABLE, FOR THEY FEEL THEIR LIVES ARE BUT NUMBERS ON A SCREEN, GRAINS OF SAND BETWEEN THE FINGERS OF THOSE EXCEPTIONAL FEW THAT HAVE ESTABLISHED THEMSELVES TO A POSITION OF AUTHORITY. BUT LEARN THEIR PLACE THEY MUST, FOR THEY ARE THE COGS IN A GREATER MACHINE THAT IS THE IMPERIUM OF MAN.

WELL MOMMY SAYS I'M SPECIAL!

[Brother Attallios]

Just now, Half-Note said:

WELL MOMMY SAYS I'M SPECIAL!

YOUR MOTHER MAY BE CORRECT HOWEVER MOST LIKELY SHE TRIED TO REINFORCE YOUR SENSE OF SELF WORTH AS A HUMBLE MORTAL. DISTINGUISH YOURSELF AS AN EXCEPTIONAL INDIVIDUAL WITH POTENTIAL AND COMMIT GREAT ACTS OF COMPETENT SERVITUDE OR VALOUR AND YE MAY YET ACHIEVE GREATER HONOURS.

[Half-Note]

7 minutes ago, Brother Attallios said:

YOUR MOTHER MAY BE CORRECT HOWEVER MOST LIKELY SHE TRIED TO REINFORCE YOUR SENSE OF SELF WORTH AS A HUMBLE MORTAL. DISTINGUISH YOURSELF AS AN EXCEPTIONAL INDIVIDUAL WITH POTENTIAL AND COMMIT GREAT ACTS OF COMPETENT SERVITUDE OR VALOUR AND YE MAY YET ACHIEVE GREATER HONOURS.

NATIONALISM! BLATANT NATIONALISM! THAT DOES IT, I AM GOING ON WELFARE AND WILL USE THE MONEY I SAVE UP FROM IT TO COMMIT A MURDERING SPREE! I SHALL BE DUBBED, ANDERS BEHRING BREIVIK THE 2ND!

[Brass]

23 minutes ago, Brother Attallios said:

YOUR MOTHER MAY BE CORRECT HOWEVER MOST LIKELY SHE TRIED TO REINFORCE YOUR SENSE OF SELF WORTH AS A HUMBLE MORTAL. DISTINGUISH YOURSELF AS AN EXCEPTIONAL INDIVIDUAL WITH POTENTIAL AND COMMIT GREAT ACTS OF COMPETENT SERVITUDE OR VALOUR AND YE MAY YET ACHIEVE GREATER HONOURS.

By special it is meant that he's a filthy psyker

[I Did It For The Cat Girls]

While I take issue with capitalism in some respects, I don't hate rich people. Many of them "earned" their wealth legitimately.  

I just despise how much political faculty they command on a global scale. It's truly mind-boggling.

 

[evan]

http://www.wsj.com/articles/can-money-buy-happiness-heres-what-science-has-to-say-1415569538

 

@AshleyAshes, I was arguing on your side, but some of these statistics are suggesting otherwise. Doing more research.

 

I think the only important counter argument right now is that, upon looking into those stats a bit more, they're a result of daily satisfaction, daily happiness which isn't necessarily the best modicum of other forms of intrinsic satisfaction. There could be concerns about happiness as a result of gratification rather than as a result of more intrinsic properties. Also, the same study suggests that materialistic purchases rarely satisfy the consumer as much as travel or experience based purchases, which only further begs the question of whether it's really the income that is putting lower class peoples into a state of lesser satisfaction, or the inability to travel due to working position.

The statistics in general are actually kind of difficult to draw a conclusion from, in that it's based on a response that isn't necessarily predicated upon objectiveness, so much as people's own opinions of their lives, which means that a lot of this depends specifically on what they feel matters, which may not acknowledge a superficiality as growth continues.

However, if read for the specific point of the argument we're having, yes, the old studies of there being "happiness to an extent" has been put under question. To what extent is this based on actual self-actualization? I'd say that much is indeterminate currently.

Edited December 11, 2015 by evan

[FlynnCoyote]

3 hours ago, Brother Attallios said:

THE FRUSTRATION OF CITIZENS HERE IS UNDERSTANDABLE, FOR THEY FEEL THEIR LIVES ARE BUT NUMBERS ON A SCREEN, GRAINS OF SAND BETWEEN THE FINGERS OF THOSE EXCEPTIONAL FEW THAT HAVE ESTABLISHED THEMSELVES TO A POSITION OF AUTHORITY. BUT LEARN THEIR PLACE THEY MUST, FOR THEY ARE THE COGS IN A GREATER MACHINE THAT IS THE IMPERIUM OF MAN.

But the Tau offered me a better deal. :v

[Brass]

10 minutes ago, FlynnCoyote said:

But the Tau offered me a better deal. :v

This is treason-- high heresy. Their technology is an abomination, and lacks the gift of the machine spirit.

[Machine]

The rich should be fed to the homeless.

[Rassah]

Even the Onion points out the absurdity of the claims of some here that you can only be rich if you were born rich or into a rich family, and that if you're poor, you're always destined to be poor. At some point everyone started off poor...

http://www.theonion.com/article/scientists-rich-people-poor-people-may-have-shared-36547

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

The Svoboda party is National-Socialistic. That is Nazism. Fair enough, they may not have had the building plans for the gas chambers presented to the public yet, but it is an ultranationalist party, so they certainly grow on the same trees, just not the same branch.

They're not really Nazi "we want only pure race here in Ukraine" nationalistic, they're "Ukraine is an independent country with its own culture, which has been invaded and occupied by various countries like Poland and Russia long enough! No more Russian occupation!" nationalistic. They don't care so much about Russians and Russian language, as Russia the country trying to take back control like it had during USSR, especially with the deposed ex president being all buddy buddy with Putin.

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

I did find a reference to the cyber-attack you mentioned, but nothing linking the Russian gov't to it. It may have been a pro-Russian/anti-Ukrainian who did it, for all I know.

Russian government media would not have reported the exact numbers if they didn't know them from the virus that "someone" inserted into to the voting machines...

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

Following the USSR anti-church campaign, the separation of church and state is an actuality. If it was a border-line theocracy, as you implied earlier, I think there'd be harder punishment for homosexuality than just limitation to ridiculous behavior too.

Actually, what happened after the fall of USSR was that religion was suddenly legalized, and without prior experience on how to deal with it, people's religiosity swung WAY overboard to the other side. The 90's and 2000's were full of cults, holistic bullshit, spirituality camps, yoga, Hindu, etc. Hell, one of my childhood friends I and my Ukrainian friend have not heard from for over a decade now cause she moved out to join some cult back in the 90's. So with people not being experienced with how to recognize bullshit, the Orthodox Church managed to get a lot of followers and power, and now do actually rule the government hand in hand. You say there would be harder punishment, well, kissing in public, or just saying that gays are normal healthy people is considered spreading pro-homosexual propaganda and will get you years in jail. There are even talks about banning women from bars because that's not moral.

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

As for numbers of subscribers to neo-Nazi publications, I believe the number to be much lower, as it is likely, if they are as radical as you say, that they would possibly subscribe to multiple magazines.

That just corroborates the numbers. If there are 475,000 subscribers to Nazi Today, and 500,000 subscribers to Zeig Heil Nation, then you can confidently say that there are at least 475,000 Nazis... 

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

But I love debating you. :C

Feel free to address any concerns or pose questions from that video. I guess I can ask you, if we need socialism for the most important things in our lives, then why don't we have socialist grocery stores, and the capitalist ones are so great with so much variety and so little problems?

5 hours ago, Half-Note said:

Also, if you're gay, I'd love to marry you and kill you in your sleep to inherit all your wealth. <3

My wealth is in Bitcoin, meaning M-of-N split private keys, and automatic disbursement though dead man switch type software. If I die, no amount of lawyers will be able to force where that inheritance goes. Plus I've already been married for like 16 years.

 

4 hours ago, I Did It For The Cat Girls said:

I just despise how much political faculty they command on a global scale. It's truly mind-boggling.

 

But... That's the Democratic, pro-socialism guy! He's the "good guy" rich who keeps saying we should have higher taxes and more free stuff.

[Pignog]

29 minutes ago, Rassah said:

But... That's the Democratic, pro-socialism guy! He's the "good guy" rich who keeps saying we should have higher taxes and more free stuff.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say "socialism" is just your catch-all term for things you don't like

2 hours ago, FlynnCoyote said:

But the Tau offered me a better deal. :v

it's been years for me, do the tau have any close-combat melee battlesuits yet? ugh why am i asking this... never again 40k...

Edited December 11, 2015 by Pignog

[Rassah]

2 minutes ago, Pignog said:

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say "socialism" is just your catch-all term for things you don't like

Well, then you'd be dumb, because George Soros is actually the Democrat's rich guy, and has stated many times that rich like him should pay more taxes, funded and supported passage of many government social programs, and funded many Democratic candidates, from Clinton to Dean to Obama to Hillary.

[Pignog]

please look up a dictionary definition of socialism and compare it to your post

 

[Rassah]

32 minutes ago, Pignog said:

please look up a dictionary definition of socialism and compare it to your post

Why would I need to do that? I used to be a far left socialist democrat, who was heavy into politics, supported Kerry and Obama just like Bernie supporters are supporting him, and was all into raising taxes on the rich, regulating evil corporations to protect us from them, and having social programs to keep the poor fed, housed, and taken care of. I'm quite familiar with the topic. Maybe you spend look into it.

By the way, bit off topic, but kind of disappointing that when I would talk about or suggest investing in bitcoin, people here would just ridicule it and make fun of me, to the point that I barely brought it up. It's up 25% this week alone (I've made a return in the high six figures), 50% in the last month, and 100% in the last three. Would just have needed some patience while it didn't do anything for the prior few months, but anyone who listened could have doubled your money already. Alas, it's a topic that I know much about and can give inside info on, but one that is not welcome here.

[Half-Note]

22 minutes ago, Rassah said:

They're not really Nazi "we want only pure race here in Ukraine" nationalistic, they're "Ukraine is an independent country with its own culture, which has been invaded and occupied by various countries like Poland and Russia long enough! No more Russian occupation!" nationalistic. They don't care so much about Russians and Russian language, as Russia the country trying to take back control like it had during USSR, especially with the deposed ex president being all buddy buddy with Putin.

Except there was no Russian/Polish occupation of Ukraine until they started taking power, at which point Mr. Putin claimed to want to protect the Russian people overseas (/overland) and used this as a reasoning for annexing Crimea democratically through a local, public vote.

To think so much drama could be sparked from Russia wanting Ukraine in the SCO rather than NATO. :C

32 minutes ago, Rassah said:

Russian government media would not have reported the exact numbers if they didn't know them from the virus that "someone" inserted into to the voting machines...

Could you give a source? Unfortunately I have yet to learn Russian, and so if you could provide a news article by a Russian government media platform, that would help to convince me.

33 minutes ago, Rassah said:

Actually, what happened after the fall of USSR was that religion was suddenly legalized, and without prior experience on how to deal with it, people's religiosity swung WAY overboard to the other side. The 90's and 2000's were full of cults, holistic bullshit, spirituality camps, yoga, Hindu, etc. Hell, one of my childhood friends I and my Ukrainian friend have not heard from for over a decade now cause she moved out to join some cult back in the 90's. So with people not being experienced with how to recognize bullshit, the Orthodox Church managed to get a lot of followers and power, and now do actually rule the government hand in hand. You say there would be harder punishment, well, kissing in public, or just saying that gays are normal healthy people is considered spreading pro-homosexual propaganda and will get you years in jail. There are even talks about banning women from bars because that's not moral.

I have nothing to counter this with other than immature insults so I'll just shut up.

Though like I said earlier, I agree that anti-discrimination laws should be put in place, to ensure that homosexuals are not harassed, though I still stand by my statement about being against gay marriage.

40 minutes ago, Rassah said:

That just corroborates the numbers. If there are 475,000 subscribers to Nazi Today, and 500,000 subscribers to Zeig Heil Nation, then you can confidently say that there are at least 475,000 Nazis....

But is it safe to say that all subscribers are based in Russia? Russian is spoken by more than 150,000,000 people across the world, some countries like Ukraine, Lithuania and Latvia offering Russian as a second language in school. And you mentioned earlier that the country has at least half the neo-Nazi world population, but what about other neo-nazi groups like the Aryan Brotherhood including other groups with the same ideology that are spread across the world? Of course, 500,000 subscribers to a neo-Nazi magazine is a lot, but does this mean there are approximately 1,000,000 neo-Nazis in the world?

50 minutes ago, Rassah said:

Feel free to address any concerns or pose questions from that video. I guess I can ask you, if we need socialism for the most important things in our lives, then why don't we have socialist grocery stores, and the capitalist ones are so great with so much variety and so little problems?

I have yet to watch it, but I will in due time. On to your question.

Because if we had them, we would take one step from socialism to communism. My interpretation of my ideology, socialistic-capitalism is that the free market should have some regulations (which means we should rename it the "regulated market", but that's beside the point), but that trade should be allowed as per the individual's choice. Groceries are everyday items we don't need a government body to be in full control of because there's a demand, high production and a high supply, and it allows room for competition between individual businesses. Because of competition, prices are pressed down, and because of the high supply, it can be privatized without concern because you won't need to worry about the price of a box of nutella becoming equal to that of a heart transplant. The only regulation that's really needed in the food market is that for ensuring that the food is of a high enough quality to eat, and make sure that there won't be traces of rat poison in your cheese, for example, which is what the United States Department of Agriculture in the US and Mattilsynet (literally "The Food Inspection") in Norway are for .

You might want to draw the parallel-argument here with other services, like healthcare, which is privatized in the United States, but that is a lot different, from my point of view, because you can't just rip out a heart from someone else when someone needs a heart transplant, because you need to wait for a voluntary organ donor to bite the dust and then quickly transport the heart to the hospital and perform the surgery before the heart stops working due to post-mortem. You can't store hearts for future use in the refrigerator and therefore, hearts are in a low supply, and with the qualifications needed to perform such a procedure, the price is pressed up to the point where no average citizen can afford it without falling into crushing debt, which is why I believe it is best to have everyone work together by paying slightly more of their income to be insured from health issues. Of course, you might say that the insurance company model provides a way for people to choose wether or not they want help, they can still get fucked over because of reasons provided by the health insurance company, whom may not even want to pay for the procedure because it is "pre-meditated" or because it "costs more than what their insurances cover". Sure, the tax model might force you to pay, but it's a lot more secure than the insurance model in case of disaster, and the general citizen would not pay much more of his income than if he had an insurance.

1 hour ago, Rassah said:

My wealth is in Bitcoin, meaning M-of-N split private keys, and automatic disbursement though dead man switch type software. If I die, no amount of lawyers will be able to force where that inheritance goes. Plus I've already been married for like 16 years.

DITCH THEM FOR ME, SENPAI! D:<

Or send me some of your funds. Show your American values. Help a person in need. <3

[Guest]

I've seen this echoed in the thread here and there, but I'm basically gonna say: Calling a job 'easy' when you don't work it sounds stupid childish. 

Like, I know the artists here who charge a bit get that shit some from time to time. "You drew this in like 20 minutes, why does it cost so much money?!" A) I went to college (~50k debt) to learn. B) I practiced every day so that the education was worthwhile, C) I have been doiring this for five years and D) I am owed a livable wage thats proportional to the work I fucking put in. 

Reiterating: Calling someone elses's job easy- especially CEOs, is childish. With more wealth comes more responsibility.

Secondly: Capitalism in and of itself isn't bad. If there was a system in which the people were cared for for their basic needs, capitalism wouldn't be so terrible. I figure things like socialized health care (of all facets) would help out a shit ton of people. Medical debt alone is a huge reason why folks are so broke. If possible, community college also being paid via taxes would allow more people to get higher education- which wouldn't it widen the pool for more jobs, since more educated people could reasonably be expected to increase the chances of people embracing capitalism and making their own businesses?

[Lucyfish]

Being a CEO isn't "easy" persay, but is it millions of dollars worth of difficult? Personally, I don't think so.

[Rassah]

1 hour ago, Half-Note said:

Except there was no Russian/Polish occupation of Ukraine

Throughout history...

Ukraine was established a very very long time ago in 600 AD, at which point it was called Kievan Rus. Russia didn't even exist for about 300 years since, being just swampy territory with wild Finnish tribes. 300 years after its founding one of the disliked relatives of Ukraine's ruling family broke off and went to form his own country which he called Moskoviche. He even tried invading Ukraine and sacking Kiev, but got his ass handed to him. Eventually, Kievan Rus (Ukraine) became one of the bigger, more powerful European countries. Then the Ottoman Empire started to invade from the west, with a simple condition: You join us and subjugate yourselves to us, or we kill you. When they invaded Moskoviche, the ruling Tzar joined them and became their lackey, so that country was spared. When the ottomans got to Ukraine, they were told to fuck off, and after some major fighting, Kiev was sacked and destroyed, along with Kievan Rus.

For the next few centuries, Kievan Rus, now Ukraine, was struggling to keep its nation status, while being constantly invaded by Poland from the west, Russia (Ottomans) from the east, and Tatars from the south. In part to raid villages for their resources, and in larger part to capture slaves (yep, lots of whites had slave roots too).

Eventually people there had enough, so they formed a decentralized, democratic, voluntary military force, the Cossacks, which would defend nearby villages from invading. That cut down on Polish and Russian invasions a lot, but not much. Also, eventually, around 1700's, the Ottoman Empire came into family issues, fell back, and collapsed, leaving Moskoviche all to itself. But that point, Moskoviche had its own slew of royals and nobles, being all hoity toity and trying to be European. But they had a big problem: for the last many centuries, they were basically huns, related to Atilla. It was considered an embarrassment, for whatever reason. So Moskoviche decided to change things, imported a half dozen professional historians from Europe, swore them to secrecy, and had them write a whole new original history for Moskoviche, "old" books and all. Now, Moskoviche and Kievan Rus was one and the same. Moskoviche was just Kievan Rus itself, but after it expanded into their territory. They even renamed their country from Moskoviche to Rus or Rosiya (which you now know as Russia), basically stealing ALL of Ukraine's history and appropriating it for themselves. And ever since, two different countries with two different languages, cultures, and histories, have taught their children two completely different histories:

One about how their country has a deep rich history, but has been invaded constantly and has a history of struggle and eventual interdependence,

And the other about how their country has a deep rich history (that actually belonged to the first country), has always been strong except for a few invasions here and there, and how eventually some people in some part of the country decided to break off to do their own thing.

This is why Ukraine has a strong dislike for Russia, resents the history of being invaded by Russia constantly and occupied by it for 70+ years as USSR (including that Holodomor incident), and has a strong nationalist pride thing after finally gaining independence (again, after centuries). While Russians think Ukraine is a part of them, and want to take them "back" under their control.

So, now you know the history and the source of the centuries old conflict. Source: I'm Ukrainian, went to Ukrainian school in USSR, went to Ukrainian Saturday school up to and including highschool here in the states where I had to study its history, and continued to study its history since. I can probably provide some links, but you really would need to read history books about this stuff, since it's not readily available.

 

[Rassah]

2 hours ago, Half-Note said:

at which point Mr. Putin claimed to want to protect the Russian people overseas (/overland) and used this as a reasoning for annexing Crimea democratically through a local, public vote.

Except there was nothing Democratic about it. "Little green men" showed up without any military insignia, annexed Crimea, and then had an election after the fact, complete with armed intimidating thugs at the ballot boxes to make sure you voted right, and with the vote being between two choices:

1) Become independent under Russia's control

2) Become part of Russia

The choice to remain part of Ukraine, or become an independent country, wasn't even on the ballot (you can look that up too). And this AFTER Ukraine elected the most moderate, centrist, liberal, and inclusive guy for persistent.

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To think so much drama could be sparked from Russia wanting Ukraine in the SCO rather than NATO. :C

Actually it was because Ukraine discovered vast shake gas reserves in the East, and had companies like Chevron and Shell building fracking wells and refineries there, which would have threatened Russia's monopoly on gas to Europe, and Europe really doesn't like Russia, what with them being so crazy. Again, easily verifiable.

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Though like I said earlier, I agree that anti-discrimination laws should be put in place, to ensure that homosexuals are not harassed, though I still stand by my statement about being against gay marriage.

I'm pretty sure instead of antidiscrimination laws, things will move in the opposite direction. Russia is becoming more conservative and right wing. And more fascist. Since oil prices crashed, and Russian government and GDP depends on it for more than half of its income, Russian economy has been in the toilet. Their propaganda about Nazis on the border in Ukraine, and USA getting ready to invade them any minute now, has reached Hitlerian proportions with its scapegoating and trying to distract from problems and shift blame.

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But is it safe to say that all subscribers are based in Russia?

Yes. I think think the addresses are Russian. There's a wiki article on neonasizm in Russia that talks about this and provides links.

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And you mentioned earlier that the country has at least half the neo-Nazi world population, but what about other neo-nazi groups like the Aryan Brotherhood including other groups with the same ideology that are spread across the world?

Including those, yes. Aryan Brotherhood are still Nazis.

Quote

On to your question.

Because if we had them, we would take one step from socialism to communism. My interpretation of my ideology, socialistic-capitalism is that the free market should have some regulations (which means we should rename it the "regulated market", but that's beside the point), but that trade should be allowed as per the individual's choice. Groceries are everyday items we don't need a government body to be in full control of because there's a demand, high production and a high supply, and it allows room for competition between individual businesses. Because of competition, prices are pressed down, and because of the high supply, it can be privatized without concern because you won't need to worry about the price of a box of nutella becoming equal to that of a heart transplant. <snip>

You might want to draw the parallel-argument here with other services, like healthcare, which is privatized in the United States, but that is a lot different, from my point of view, because you can't just rip out a heart from someone else when someone needs a heart transplant, because you need to wait for a voluntary organ donor to bite the dust and then quickly transport the heart to the hospital and perform the surgery before the heart stops working due to post-mortem. You can't store hearts for future use in the refrigerator and therefore, hearts are in a low supply, and with the qualifications needed to perform such a procedure, the price is pressed up to the point where no average citizen can afford it without falling into crushing debt, which is why I believe it is best to have everyone work together by paying slightly more of their income to be insured from health issues. Of course, you might say that the insurance company model provides a way for people to choose wether or not they want help, they can still get fucked over because of reasons provided by the health insurance company, whom may not even want to pay for the procedure because it is "pre-meditated" or because it "costs more than what their insurances cover". Sure, the tax model might force you to pay, but it's a lot more secure than the insurance model in case of disaster, and the general citizen would not pay much more of his income than if he had an insurance.

I don't support the current insurance structure, since it doesn't even work in a free capitalist market. There is no competition on insurance, with most insurance being provided to you by your employer, with the employer covering 1/2 to 2/3rd of the cost without employees even knowing about it, and hospitals and doctors never publishing, discussing, or negotiating prices for their services. No competition in the health market at all. That's why it's so stupid expensive.

But that's a much too complicated topic. What about things like roads, water, police?

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DITCH THEM FOR ME, SENPAI! D:<

Or send me some of your funds. Show your American values. Help a person in need. <3

I will never ditch my bitcoins! And why would you want them? They're just magic internet monopoly tulip moneys.

[Rassah]

52 minutes ago, Lemon said:

Like, I know the artists here who charge a bit get that shit some from time to time. "You drew this in like 20 minutes, why does it cost so much money?!" A) I went to college (~50k debt) to learn. B) I practiced every day so that the education was worthwhile, C) I have been doiring this for five years and D) I am owed a livable wage thats proportional to the work I fucking put in. 

You could also add E) That is what I'm selling my skills for, because that's what I value them at. Don't like the price, pay for someone else's time.

Funny how no one complains about something being expensive in a store. They just don't buy it, or shop somewhere else. But these buggers feel entitled to your labor like you're their slave or something...

52 minutes ago, Lemon said:

If there was a system in which the people were cared for for their basic needs, capitalism wouldn't be so terrible. I figure things like socialized health care (of all facets) would help out a shit ton of people. Medical debt alone is a huge reason why folks are so broke. If possible, community college also being paid via taxes would allow more people to get higher education- which wouldn't it widen the pool for more jobs, since more educated people could reasonably be expected to increase the chances of people embracing capitalism and making their own businesses?

Healthcare and education doesn't come free. Either the doctors and teachers have to provide it out of their own time, or someone else has to give up their labor to pay for it (through taxes). Funny how some buggers feel entitled to your labor like you're their slave or something

But seriously, with regards to healthcare, personally I would prefer stripping most of the regulations from that while thing, since they're mostly about who can sell insurance where (to keep competitors out), who can become what kind of a doctor (to keep the number of doctors artificially low), who can make what kind of medicines and which medicines can be approved (in case some medicine harms you while you are trying to cure your terminal illness), etc. Get some competition and experimentation going, and we'll have Star Trek style tricorders replacing doctor visits, and 3D printed organs and medicines in no time.

As for education, the lack of educated people isn't really the problem with our unemployment issues. It's the lack of businesses and jobs to hire the people we already have. There are already plenty of free options to get a higher education. I pimp Khan Academy all the time on this and previous forum, and there are others like it. Having a live professor doesn't really add anything to your education except a huge debt.