Chaos in Cologne on New Year's Eve, refugee-crisis is escalating

[Käpt'n]

You might have heard about it, but on New Year's Eve the police lost control over robbers and rapists in Cologne, Germany around the central station.
Men were preying on women in groups, people were violently robbed, there were countless people injured. The police got hundreds of reports from women who were raped or beaten up.
The police released a report a few days later, in it they say that they entirely lost control over the situation. They couldn't arrest anyone because they were over capacity, people were ignoring them completely and when the situation escalated completely they fully expected there to be casualties. People were beating up each other to get on and off the trains, they were running over the tracks and went through police blockades.

The report also says that the vast majority of the perpetrators were groups of refugees who recently arrived in Germany... Smartphones that were reported as stolen have been located in refugee homes. Known gangs of immigrants from North Africa have also been reported. Some of them apparently had notes with them for translations, shit like "big titties", "I want to fuck" or broken variations of "I will kill you if you don't let me fuck you".

People were unhappy with the situation to begin with, but that is probably gonna get a lot more traction now... The nazis at PEGIDA probably love this situation. The head of the police of Cologne has already been retired and our government wants to implement stricter laws for refugees and rapists in general.

Dolan Trump naturally jumped right onto this and used it as an example for what happens when you let arabic foreigners into your country. What a surprise...

Personally I'm just sad that this is happening here. There is always some shit going on on NYE, but never like this! It has never happened before that the police essentially has to resort to damage control because they lost control over the situation like that! And it happened all over Germany in the bigger cities, it was just especially severe in Cologne...

I'm curious what your opinion is on this since most users here are Americans or live outside of Germany in general. Are you against refugees? Would this motivate you to have refugees kicked out to some degree?
I want people to come here, I think it's great and it should be the duty of a modern country to help people in need! What I don't want them to do is slowly turn our country into one of those uncivilized middle eastern countries where they came from D:

Edited January 9, 2016 by Käpt'n

[Khaki]

Probably would have saved a lot of grief if Merkel had instituted a "Women and children only" policy when it came to refugees from "Syria",

would have maintained the country's pride as a "progressive humanitarian state, etc" whilst drastically cutting back on the refugee intake.

 

Also congratulations, you know now what happens when large numbers of African/Middle Eastern males start forming dog packs.

1 hour ago, Käpt'n said:

I want people to come here, I think it's great and it should be the duty of a modern country to help people in need!

There's a difference between helping people in need and having your altruistic nature taken for granted.

[Saxon]

I'm always amazed when I hear that Germany has taken 1 million refugees in the past year. 

I agree with recent suggestions that asylum seekers, convicted of crimes, should be fast-tracked for deportation.

I am also moved to wonder whether newly arrived migrants should be given classes in Deutsch and German law and cultural values.

[Dr. Doggo]

4 hours ago, Käpt'n said:

 to help people in need!

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're not delusional, but not paying attention.

The refugees were safe as soon as they entered Turkey (and the Balkans) but they still want to advance - they want to go where the money is. There is also not a single wealthy/safe Arab country accepting refugees. In Hungary there's been a huge mess where thousands of young me- I mean helpless women and children preferred to riot, attack border staff, and throw away provisions given to them. They do this even though they are being encouraged to use the legal channels to achieve refugee status, where they don't even need papers, they would rather remain completely undocumented and invisible because they are helpless people that can be trusted. Passports and papers have already been found abandoned, and only a minority of those were Syrian. The people of Greece and southern Italy are suffering at the hands of these refugees, from vandalism to robbery to rape to murder and there is an overwhelming media silence, just like it took a week for the NYE incident in Cologne to be reported on. It's a deliberate cover-up, it was only reported on because there were too many eyewitnesses to cover up the incident. There are hundreds of eyewitness videos of these migrants and the attitudes they display as they arrive as well as the things they do, but these are not allowed into the mainstream and are dismissed as "right-wing propaganda", which is actually very interesting because European media outlets have an extremely clear left-wing/multikulti bias. Recorded events cannot be propaganda. Millions of people are entering europe through illegal channels and remain completely undocumented, but it would be too insensitive to assume that there is any kind of consequence to be found from this at all.

But it's fine and dandy because they're in vulnerable and in need, we gotta do what we can.

When a few more Swedish idiots let their daughters' throats get slit because they let a caveman live with them to prove to their neighbors how tolerant they are, maybe a few shootings, a few thousand underage girls getting gang-raped, some more terror attacks, some massive scenes of violence, more incidents like in Cologne to a point where the media can't decide to ignore it, people are inevitably going to start murdering foreigners in the street. They may act alone, or start an organised co-ordinated effort.

It's a real shame that our values of diversity and peace have to be ruined by a bunch of neo-nazis. This is 2016 for gods' sake.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Sir Gibby

[Nova]

Well, its mostly germanies fault because they let refugees in in an uncontrolled mass. They should split the mass up but now its overflowing. 

[Dr. Doggo]

2 minutes ago, Nova said:

 They should split the mass up

That's exactly what they're doing, they're forcing EU members to accept tens of thousands of migrants regardless of the individual countries' ability or willingness to co-operate. And those numbers just keep increasing.

[willow]

from what I've heard, a lot of refugees would have loved to stay in Turkey because it's somewhat familiar, but the Turkish government isn't doing much to help them relocate there. 

it's an unfortunate situation and it's unfortunate that this will be used as leverage to not let any refugees in

[Saxon]

8 minutes ago, willow said:

from what I've heard, a lot of refugees would have loved to stay in Turkey because it's somewhat familiar, but the Turkish government isn't doing much to help them relocate there. 

it's an unfortunate situation and it's unfortunate that this will be used as leverage to not let any refugees in

Turkey has already accepted ~2.5m Syrian refugees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War

It would be quite unfair to expect Turkey to accept all of the refugees. Turkey also struggles to maintain safe conditions for refugees who the Islamic state has accused of being informants. Islamists get into Turkey, track down the accused, and behead them. 

 

Gibby is right that a lot of people don't want to stay in Turkey and South-East Europe because of economic reasons, though. There are even 'refugees' coming from countries which aren't warzones, like Iran, Bangladesh and Morocco. 

[willow]

5 minutes ago, Saxon said:

Turkey has already accepted ~2.5m Syrian refugees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War

It would be quite unfair to expect Turkey to accept all of the refugees. Turkey also struggles to maintain safe conditions for refugees who the Islamic state has accused of being informants. Islamists get into Turkey, track down the accused, and behead them. 

I'm just going off of what I've been told by actual Syrian refugees..

[Saxon]

3 minutes ago, willow said:

I'm just going off of what I've been told by actual Syrian refugees..

I wasn't disagreeing with you. It's possible the Turkish government isn't helping more people in because they've already taken the equivalent of a small country.

[Gamedog]

Those "nazis" of PEGIDA are your only hope.
You and your country were warned and you ignored it. You continue to make groups like PEGIDA out to be the enemy, while letting the enemy rape your wives and children.

 

Germany will suffer the consequences.

 

 

Here's some more. Take these instances as a warning of what's to come.
http://countercontempt.tumblr.com/post/136844873490/madworldnews-liberal-host-family-discovers-what

[Käpt'n]

1 hour ago, Saxon said:

I'm always amazed when I hear that Germany has taken 1 million refugees in the past year. 

I agree with recent suggestions that asylum seekers, convicted of crimes, should be fast-tracked for deportation.

I am also moved to wonder whether newly arrived migrants should be given classes in Deutsch and German law and cultural values.

One million is a lot, but they managed to spread them out so much that you hardly even notice them. Well, usually...

What would deporting them do though? If you just throw them out they won't be convicted for their crimes and sending them home is pretty much the same as a death sentence... Or at least it puts them at a very high risk of dying there. And if you put them in prison people will still be pissed because prisons are paid for by the tax payers.

They do get classes in German. But I agree that they should learn about how we live as well. It would make integration easier.

37 minutes ago, Sir Gibby said:

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're not delusional, but not paying attention.

The refugees were safe as soon as they entered Turkey (and the Balkans) but they still want to advance - they want to go where the money is. There is also not a single wealthy/safe Arab country accepting refugees. In Hungary there's been a huge mess where thousands of young me- I mean helpless women and children preferred to riot, attack border staff, and throw away provisions given to them. They do this even though they are being encouraged to use the legal channels to achieve refugee status, where they don't even need papers, they would rather remain completely undocumented and invisible because they are helpless people that can be trusted. Passports and papers have already been found abandoned, and only a minority of those were Syrian. The people of Greece and southern Italy are suffering at the hands of these refugees, from vandalism to robbery to rape to murder and there is an overwhelming media silence, just like it took a week for the NYE incident in Cologne to be reported on. It's a deliberate cover-up, it was only reported on because there were too many eyewitnesses to cover up the incident. There are hundreds of eyewitness videos of these migrants and the attitudes they display as they arrive as well as the things they do, but these are not allowed into the mainstream and are dismissed as "right-wing propaganda", which is actually very interesting because European media outlets have an extremely clear left-wing/multikulti bias. Recorded events cannot be propaganda. Millions of people are entering europe through illegal channels and remain completely undocumented, but it would be too insensitive to assume that there is any kind of consequence to be found from this at all.

But it's fine and dandy because they're in vulnerable and in need, we gotta do what we can.

When a few more Swedish idiots let their daughters' throats get slit because they let a caveman live with them to prove to their neighbors how tolerant they are, maybe a few shootings, a few thousand underage girls getting gang-raped, some more terror attacks, some massive scenes of violence, more incidents like in Cologne to a point where the media can't decide to ignore it, people are inevitably going to start murdering foreigners in the street. They may act alone, or start an organised co-ordinated effort.

It's a real shame that our values of diversity and peace have to be ruined by a bunch of neo-nazis. This is 2016 for gods' sake.

I'm aware that many people come here because they are mooches. And I agree that those should be sent home.

But there ARE many people among them who really do need help! And again, I think it is the duty of a modern country to offer help where it's needed. But it is not our duty to let in everyone.

37 minutes ago, Nova said:

Well, its mostly germanies fault because they let refugees in in an uncontrolled mass. They should split the mass up but now its overflowing. 

Split them up to where? Europe isn't that rich! The EU is being carried by a few rich countries, the other ones are happy that they are getting by.
Should we send them to Greece? Or Italy? Or how about the developing countries in the east of Eurpope? How about Romania! Thousands of people from there have been migrating to Germany to get more social benefits than what they earn there, they got enough room for refugees now, right? :V

 

10 minutes ago, Saxon said:

Turkey has already accepted ~2.5m Syrian refugees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War

It would be quite unfair to expect Turkey to accept all of the refugees. Turkey also struggles to maintain safe conditions for refugees who the Islamic state has accused of being informants. Islamists get into Turkey, track down the accused, and behead them. 

 

Gibby is right that a lot of people don't want to stay in Turkey and South-East Europe because of economic reasons, though. There are even 'refugees' coming from countries which aren't warzones, like Iran, Bangladesh and Morocco. 

Turkey really did accept a LOT of refugees and that's great. The problem is that Turkey is still a shithole and they are at the front of the IS conflict, so I can see why the refugees want to leave.

[Gamedog]

2 minutes ago, Käpt'n said:

They do get classes in German. But I agree that they should learn about how we live as well. It would make integration easier.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

[Saxon]

 

1 minute ago, Gamedog said:

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

That's why I think it should be made very clear that if you defile any native citizens, or incite violence, then it's mandatory deportation. 

[Gamedog]

2 minutes ago, Saxon said:

 

That's why I think it should be made very clear that if you defile any native citizens, or incite violence, then it's mandatory deportation. 

You are permitted one rape before being deported back to a country that has strict rules saying that refugees can't be deported back

Gotcha.

[Dr. Doggo]

2 minutes ago, Saxon said:

 

That's why I think it should be made very clear that if you defile any native citizens, or incite violence, then it's mandatory deportation. 

Pretty sure the control the EU exercises makes deportation very difficult if not impossible, based on the offender having "human rights" and "right to a family life" and get to stay in the country regardless of what they've done.

[Saxon]

1 minute ago, Gamedog said:

You are permitted one rape before being deported back to a country that has strict rules saying that refugees can't be deported back

Gotcha.

Is your alternative preemptive deportation for 0 rapes? O_o

 

[Käpt'n]

3 minutes ago, Gamedog said:

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

That is true. But at work I have met many people who didn't speak any German when they came here half a year ago, and now they actually understand me! They are nice and very grateful when you help them.

But yeah, there are black sheep as well... You always have those.

But what are you gonna do with them? Send them home and let them die? Or ask other countries to take them? I can picture how that's gonna go!

"Hey there Turkey! We got this guy from Syria here. He raped a bunch of women and committed a some other crimes, so we don't want him anymore. Can you take him?"

"Oh yeah, sure Germany! We got over 2 million refugees already, might as well take one more. And don't worry, we are gonna give him a stern talkin' to and everything will be fine ^.^"

[Gamedog]

1 minute ago, Saxon said:

Is your alternative preemptive deportation for 0 rapes? O_o

 

Yes, and don't allow any more in.

 

@Käpt'n
Good, now they can call you a "slut" and say "I will kill you if you don't let me fuck you" in literate German

Don't send them to Turkey, send them back to where they came from. What happens there is not my concern and shouldn't be yours.

[Saxon]

1 minute ago, Käpt'n said:

That is true. But at work I have met many people who didn't speak any German when they came here half a year ago, and now they actually understand me! They are nice and very grateful when you help them.

But yeah, there are black sheep as well... You always have those.

But what are you gonna do with them? Send them home and let them die? Or ask other countries to take them? I can picture how that's gonna go!

"Hey there Turkey! We got this guy from Syria here. He raped a bunch of women and committed a some other crimes, so we don't want him anymore. Can you take him?"

"Oh yeah, sure Germany! We got over 2 million refugees already, might as well take one more. And don't worry, we are gonna give him a stern talkin' to and everything will be fine ^.^"

Ideally they'd be sent to do their prison time in Syria, but I suspect that may not be possible. 

[Käpt'n]

4 minutes ago, Sir Gibby said:

Pretty sure the control the EU exercises makes deportation very difficult if not impossible, based on the offender having "human rights" and "right to a family life" and get to stay in the country regardless of what they've done.

That depends! If you don't have a German citizenship you will be deported for a crime that lands you in prison for three years. For refugees that is actually lower, but has to be decided on a case by case basis.

It is pretty safe to assume that the ones behind what happened on New Years Eve will be deported if they are caught. It's because they are labeling the whole thing as robbery, which does give you up to 5 years and it's easier to prove than rape.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Käpt'n

[Dr. Doggo]

9 minutes ago, Käpt'n said:

It is pretty safe to assume that the ones behind what happened on New Years Eve will be deported if they are caught.

Enjoy this video.

As we've seen with, for example, a somalian raping a swedish girl yelling "black dick is expensive" and getting only community service, as well as those people in cologne being let go as suggested in the video, and many more examples of this that can be found if you do some detective work online, it's safe to assume that very many offenders will not be given a sentence that could lead to 3 years imprisonment, let alone deportation.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Sir Gibby

[Hakar-Kerarmor]

3 minutes ago, Gamedog said:

Yes, and don't allow any more in.

Yes, let's get rid of the concept of innocence until proven guilty.

[Naesaki]

7 minutes ago, Hakar-Kerarmor said:

Yes, let's get rid of the concept of innocence until proven guilty.

I think you all know him well enough by now that his views are cemented in stone, pointless getting into a debate with him. save your energy Hakar for more productive things :v

[Hakar-Kerarmor]

4 minutes ago, Naesaki said:

pointless getting into a debate with him.

I feel that this is an altogether too common attitude these days. If he really is as closed-minded as you claim, I'll let him show me himself instead of taking your word for it.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Hakar-Kerarmor

[Käpt'n]

34 minutes ago, Sir Gibby said:

Enjoy this video.

As we've seen with, for example, a somalian raping a swedish girl yelling "black dick is expensive" and getting only community service, as well as those people in cologne being let go as suggested in the video, and many more examples of this that can be found if you do some detective work online, it's safe to assume that very many offenders will not be given a sentence that could lead to 3 years imprisonment, let alone deportation.

Well that video essentially just sums up what I said in the OP.

It is true that most of them will not be caught, and that is an issue.

[Rassah]

At the risk of starting a shitstorm...

Germany should ban guns! That should help reduce its issues with crime :V

[Mayonnaise]

I'm against them for the most part. I mean, most of them don't even bother to get in through proper channels. That's kind of a red flag that they do not respect other country's laws.

I have really bad experience with "refugees" before though, no thanks to our government's Project IC. So yeah, really against having more of them.

[Gamedog]

44 minutes ago, Hakar-Kerarmor said:

Yes, let's get rid of the concept of innocence until proven guilty.

I care more about my family's safety than I do the safety of a stranger from Syria

Can you imagine what would happen if I was a "refugee" and ran to Syria?
Do you think I'd be treated kindly as an anti-theist gay male?

[PastryOfApathy]

Stop being bigots.

[Hakar-Kerarmor]

1 minute ago, Gamedog said:

I care more about my family's safety than I do the safety of a stranger from Syria

Can you imagine what would happen if I was a "refugee" and ran to Syria?
Do you think I'd be treated kindly as an anti-theist gay male?

That does not mean we should follow their example.

 

Also, I wasn't talking about safety, I was talking about due process. Remember, plenty of (crazy) feminists would say that, since you are a man, you are therefore a rapist and deserve to be jailed or worse. And I think we both agree they are completely coocoo.

[Gamedog]

2 minutes ago, Hakar-Kerarmor said:

That does not mean we should follow their example.

 

Also, I wasn't talking about safety, I was talking about due process. Remember, plenty of (crazy) feminists would say that, since you are a man, you are therefore a rapist and deserve to be jailed or worse. And I think we both agree they are completely coocoo.

"Due process"
They're breaking the law, killing, and raping people with such frequency that the jails were so full on NYE that inmates who were arrested that night had to be released into the streets to make room for new inmates.

 

Where the fuck do you expect these people to be housed until "due process" is through?

[Hakar-Kerarmor]

1 minute ago, Gamedog said:

 

1 minute ago, Gamedog said:

"Due process"
They're breaking the law, killing, and raping people with such frequency that the jails were so full on NYE that inmates who were arrested that night had to be released into the streets to make room for new inmates.

Whoa whoa whoa there sparky.

You were wanting to ship them out before they had committed any of these crimes. Stick to one story will you?

[Saxon]

Whoever is being accused of the crime, due process is necessary to maintain judicial integrity. 

[Cingal]

Muslims. Not even once.

[AshleyAshes]

For the passing of these new laws to limit the rights of a specific minority, a rally and convention could be held in Nuremburg, seems like a suitable place for that kind of thing.

[Saxon]

14 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

For the passing of these new laws to limit the rights of a specific minority, a rally and convention could be held in Nuremburg, seems like a suitable place for that kind of thing.

Yes, deporting asylum seekers, convicted of robbery and sexual assault, is directly analogous to sending Jews to concentration camps. 

[Zeke]

At least Americans are making the perfect statement by sending threatening messages to the Muslims just in case they step out of line. :V

[WolfyAmbassador]

Wow, who would've known this kind of shit would happen? Those innocent refugees man... I love how it takes a ton of bad shit to happen in order for people wake up.

[willow]

23 minutes ago, WolfyAmbassador said:

Wow, who would've known this kind of shit would happen? Those innocent refugees man... I love how it takes a ton of bad shit to happen in order for people wake up.

when you're already looking for ways to condemn a whole group of people, it's pretty easy to group the bad guys in with the rest of the people who are just trying to get away from war.

that being said wonder how many more shootings it will take for the US to realize that something needs to be legitimately done about its gun laws..or its healthcare system

[Toboe]

2 hours ago, Käpt'n said:

What would deporting them do though? If you just throw them out they won't be convicted for their crimes and sending them home is pretty much the same as a death sentence... Or at least it puts them at a very high risk of dying there. And if you put them in prison people will still be pissed because prisons are paid for by the tax payers.

Send them home. Let the guilty ones sleep in the bed they made and help the innocent ones.

 

1 hour ago, Rassah said:

At the risk of starting a shitstorm...

Germany should ban guns! That should help reduce its issues with crime :V

Yeah, let's reduce Germanys problems to the USA problems... Wait one moment... :V

[Rukh Whitefang]

Due process isn't putting a rapist behind bars for a couple years. That is an easy sentence. Anyone who goes around in public and gang rapes people either should be locked away for life or put to death. Deportation doesn't work for violent illegal immigrants. Ask the border states in the U.S.A how deportation works for violent illegals...

[Käpt'n]

8 minutes ago, Rukh Whitefang said:

or put to death

No. Just no. The death sentence doesn't solve anything.

Can't say I'm surprised hearing that from the king of deranged fairy tale believers though...

[Rukh Whitefang]

4 minutes ago, Käpt'n said:

No. Just no. The death sentence doesn't solve anything.

Can't say I'm surprised hearing that from the king of deranged fairy tale believers though...

So lets put violent gang rapists in prison for a couple years then release them back into the public. Sounds like a swell idea. Or better yet because the prison system is so flooded lets release them early or put them in community service, cause that always works...

How much does it costs to put someone away for life in Germany for horrible violent crimes vs executing them?

Also, just stop with the intentional inflammatory anti-theist rhetoric already. That comment does absolutely nothing for the conversation.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Rukh Whitefang

[Käpt'n]

1 minute ago, Rukh Whitefang said:

How much does it costs to put someone away for life in Germany for horrible violent crimes vs executing them?

What does it cost? You become morally bankrupt. There is a reason why we don't have the death sentence. It doesn't work!

America has the death sentence. And judging by your overflowing prisons I can really tell how well it works as a deterrent against violent crimes!

Listen, Rukh... I hate your guts. I honestly do. If you are just gonna suggest that we should kill these people you can piss right off.

[Zeke]

7 minutes ago, Käpt'n said:

What does it cost? You become morally bankrupt. There is a reason why we don't have the death sentence. It doesn't work!

America has the death sentence. And judging by your overflowing prisons I can really tell how well it works as a deterrent against violent crimes!

Listen, Rukh... I hate your guts. I honestly do. If you are just gonna suggest that we should kill these people you can piss right off.

Mind you, we also have a lot of privatized prisons that expand duet selling their "workers" to companies for money. Things like Telemarketing are now being sourced to prisons since they do not have to pay much for training, for starters. I wouldn't say it is "overflowing", but privatized prisons are big business since they get money from the states per prisoner, plus any additional money from business contracts by providing suitable workers. The prisoners get paid less than what a normal telemarketer would get in Bangladesh, and the prisons can keep that money.

Also, a lot of the severe violent offenders are also mentally ill, and our mental health faculties are terrible. 

 

[willow]

23 minutes ago, Rukh Whitefang said:

 Deportation doesn't work for violent illegal immigrants. Ask the border states in the U.S.A how deportation works for violent illegals...

we just shoot them :v

[Onnes]

Nothing screams 'great idea' like advocating for Germany to start large-scale executions of immigrants.

[Käpt'n]

Just now, Zeke said:

Mind you, we also have a lot of privatized prisons that expand duet selling their "workers" to companies for money. Things like Telemarketing are now being sourced to prisons since they do not have to pay much for training, for starters.

Also, a lot of the severe violent offenders are also mentally ill, and our mental health faculties are terrible. 

That sounds horrible...
Many people are in prison because of mental issues. I believe that you should be punished for your crimes, but never for your illness!

[Zeke]

Just now, Onnes said:

Nothing screams 'great idea' like advocating for Germany to start large-scale executions of immigrants.

That will go over well. 

Might as well start herding them into interment camps and gaming them/