Seatbelt Laws Suck!

[Endless/Nameless]

Do you have seatbelt laws? We do.

In my state, you are required to wear a seatbelt in a vehicle at all times. This is dumb. Know why?

The law is supposed to keep us from hurting others, and protect us from being hurt ourselves. 

Seatbelt laws do neither. Seatbelt laws only protect you from yourself. 

What gives the government the right to tell me how I can and can't endanger myself? It's none of their business if I feel like getting my face smushed in by my steering wheel while cartwheeling through the jagged fragments my shattered windshield. I should be able to. I hurt no one but myself, and only I am to blame.

But NOOOOO, if i don't take steps to protect myself, the police beat me up and take my money.

We are being oppressed!! We have constitutional rights!!

YOU'RE NOT MY DAD OBAMA!!!!! YOU CAN'T MAKE ME!!!!!!!!

(The only exception is families. If we're going to have any seatbelt laws at all, it should be that parents need to have their children buckled in until they're old enough to make the decision to risk fiery death themselves. If you endanger your offspring, you're despicable)

DISCUSS.

 

[Luca]

I don't wear my seatbelt in the back seat. I live dangerously... B^)

 

[Endless/Nameless]

Just now, Luca said:

I don't wear my seatbelt in the back seat. I live dangerously... B^)

 

I too like to live dangerously. (⌐■ ͜ʖ■)

[Clove Darkwave]

No one rides in my car without a seatbelt. It is my private United States of America and I am its president.

 

I can see a valid reason for seatbelt laws you may not have considered. If you are found at fault in an auto accident, and some moron decided to not wear their seatbelt because it isn't required by law you may then also be responsible for the injuries and/or death of them rocketing through their windshield or braining themselves on something.

Harm mitigation, that's all. Don't be fucking lazy.

[Endless/Nameless]

7 minutes ago, Clove Darkwave said:

If you are found at fault in an auto accident, and some moron decided to not wear their seatbelt because it isn't required by law you may then also be responsible for the injuries and/or death of them rocketing through their windshield or braining themselves on something.

You're probably right on that. Weird.

[Clove Darkwave]

6 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

You're probably right on that. Weird.

I know right? Our court system is perhaps one of the most disappointing things in existence, best to not trust it.

[Vae]

Of all the pointless parenting bullshit that can and does fall into the hands of the legal system sometimes,
I don't know why wearing some straps in your car to keep you from flying out of your windshield is anywhere remotely high on this list.

[Toshabi]

Let's not be safe because FUCK I DO WHAT I WANT LAUGH OUT LOUD!

[Clove Darkwave]

14 minutes ago, Toshabi said:

Let's not be safe because FUCK I DO WHAT I WANT LAUGH OUT LOUD!

I still occasionally see someone wandering around in a YOLO shirt. I think they are slowly dwindling out.

[Spot]

I can't tell if you're baiting or being serious; but I'll humor you.

Coming from someone that has been in a head on crash, I can tell you, without a word of doubt, that they do indeed save more lives than they cost. Furthermore, insurance companies can often tell if the seat belt was used while in a serious crash and are often reluctant to pay out if it was not used. 

Never underestimate the usefulness of the seat belt.  

Edited March 19, 2016 by Mr. Fox

[Endless/Nameless]

Just now, Mr. Fox said:

I can't tell if you're baiting or being serious; but I'll humor you.

Coming from someone that has been in a head on crash, I can tell you, without a word of doubt, that they do indeed save more lives than they cost. Furthermore, insurance companies can often tell if the seat belt was used while in a serious crash and a often reluctant to pay out if it was not used. 

Never underestimate the usefulness of the seat belt.  

Both.

 

I actually do wear a seatbelt. Everyone should, really.

I just think it should be common sense rather than forced upon you. I can't see any legal basis for making it law.

[Spot]

If people are to incompetent to wear seat belts they shouldn't be driving in the first place. 

[Derin Darkpaw]

34 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

I just think it should be common sense rather than forced upon you. I can't see any legal basis for making it law.

Its pretty simple forcing people to wear seatbelts helps the economy.  By increasing the usage of seatbelts the number and severity of injuries suffered during car crashes is reduced.  Which leads to less productivity lost due to said injuries.  Which in turn means people are earning more and thus paying more in taxes.

If you look at the bigger picture such government initiatives like this, when created and run efficiently, end up generating more money then they cost.

Now there is an argument to be had about how much something needs to generate versus its cost to justify the use of government to enforce.  In a case like seatbelts were the use of them costs the individual next to nothing I feel the government is justified to use legal force to encourage this behavior.

[Endless/Nameless]

1 minute ago, Derin Darkpaw said:

Its pretty simple forcing people to wear seatbelts helps the economy.  By increasing the usage of seatbelts the number and severity of injuries suffered during car crashes is reduced.  Which leads to less productivity lost due to said injuries.  Which in turn means people are earning more and thus paying more in taxes.

If you look at the bigger picture such government initiatives like this, when created and run efficiently, end up generating more money then they cost.

Now there is an argument to be had about how much something needs to generate versus its cost to justify the use of government to enforce.  In a case like seatbelts were the use of them costs the individual next to nothing I feel the government is justified to use legal force to encourage this behavior.

Sounds manipulative. 

[Strongbob]

48 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

I just think it should be common sense rather than forced upon you. I can't see any legal basis for making it law.

Actually there is a legal basis, and it all boils down to $.  A typical motor vehicle fatality is given a 'cost' of around $1M.  That covers medical costs, insurance costs, burial costs, and lifetime costs for lost productivity.  If you're stupid and die because you aren't wearing a belt you cost all of us money, so ultimately it's not 'just your problem' if you die.  Whether or not we will miss you is a completely different question.  

 

So what Derin said.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Strongbob
Derin beat me to it.

[TrishaCat]

I know this is a joke in reference to that other thread but I don't think seatbelt laws and child labor laws are really comparable.

[Derin Darkpaw]

Just now, Endless/Nameless said:

Sounds manipulative. 

Of course it is.  Government is kind of by its nature manipulative.  Many times people will take actions that are not in the best interest of society at large or even themselves.  Because of this we give up some of our freedoms to the government with the intent of the government caring for and protecting society.

As I said there is a very interesting debate to be had about exactly where the line between personal freedom and government action should be drawn.  However I personally feel that the most extreme positions, anarchy and totalitarianism, tend to stifle conversation rather then encourage discussion about the best solution.

[Crazy Lee]

This kinda feels like a parody thread....
I almost feel like making a "Suck! threads suck!" thread, but it may be considered spam and I don't wish the infraction. Then again it may be worth it.

[MalletFace]

I have no idea which parts of this thread are satirical and which are serious, but seat belt laws actually happened because a northern doctor pushed for them and people agreed. He also pushed for other regulation changes that are now mandatory in most states that keep you safe.

It was more of a "I've seen too many people killed by cars; let's do something!" thing than a "How can we make more money?" thing.

I can't tell which parts are satirical because this forum just had to be full of people that blend the border between parody and reality. Gah.

Edited March 19, 2016 by MalletFace

[Toshabi]

1 hour ago, Clove Darkwave said:

I still occasionally see someone wandering around in a YOLO shirt. I think they are slowly dwindling out.

That craze is dying out over here too. Then again, the same people wearing those shirts are the kinds of people who think doing stupid shit and screaming "IT'S A PRANK BRO RELAX" makes everything okay. 

[Strongbob]

2 minutes ago, Crazy Lee said:

This kinda feels like a parody thread....
I almost feel like making a "Suck! threads suck!" thread, but it may be considered spam and I don't wish the infraction. Then again it may be worth it.

I think you have a very good grasp of the situation.  

My next thread "DUI Laws Suck!"

 

[willow]

yeah it's pretty much a parody thread, but it's also kind of interesting. it's also the first one so w/e

1 minute ago, MalletFace said:

I have no idea which parts of this thread are satirical and which are serious, but seat belt laws actually happened because a northern doctor pushed for them and people agreed. He also pushed for other regulation changes that are now mandatory in most states that keep you safe.

It was more of a "I've seen too many people killed by cars; let's do something!" thing than a "How can we make more money?" thing.

weren't people falling out of the cars too or something?

[Strongbob]

So·cial Dar·win·ism

noun

the theory that individuals, groups, and peoples are subject to the same Darwinian laws of natural selection as plants and animals. Now largely discredited, social Darwinism was advocated by Herbert Spencer and others in the late 19th and early 20th centuries and was used to justify political conservatism, imperialism, and racism and to discourage intervention and reform.

[Derin Darkpaw]

Just now, MalletFace said:

I have no idea which parts of this thread are satirical and which are serious, but seat belt laws actually happened because a northern doctor pushed for them and people agreed. He also pushed for other regulation changes that are now mandatory and keep you safe.

It was more of a "I've seen too many people killed by cars; let's do something!" thing than a "How can we make more money?" thing.

I can't tell which parts are satirical because this forum just had to be full of people that blend the border between parody and reality. Gah.

For my part I was simply pointing out how there are incentives other then moral reasoning that would make it so a government should take action to enforce the wearing of seatbelts.  The idea of government as moral guardian can be a fairly debatable position.  Especially seeing as what is or is not morally good is a further debatable topic.  I find that generally people agree that the government should be concerned with the well-being of its citizens which is usually reflected, in the eyes of many people, in economic performance.  So I presented the argument from an economic position rather then a moral one.

[Endless/Nameless]

Thank you all for posting and discussing.

5 minutes ago, MalletFace said:

I can't tell which parts are satirical because this forum just had to be full of people that blend the border between parody and reality. Gah.

5 minutes ago, Strongbob said:

My next thread "DUI Laws Suck!"

Drunk driving harms other people. Different ball game. But feel free to make that thread.  

 

[Strongbob]

10 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

Thank you all for posting and discussing.

Drunk driving harms other people. Different ball game. But feel free to make that thread.  

 

 

[Astus]

You people are silly; don't you know that if you're driving fast enough and hit into another car you can fly through both windshields and hurt the other person? This isn't about your safety, it's about making sure other people aren't harmed by your flying dead body 

[Endless/Nameless]

2 minutes ago, Astus said:

You people are silly; don't you know that if you're driving fast enough and hit into another car you can fly through both windshields and hurt the other person? This isn't about your safety, it's about making sure other people aren't harmed by your flying dead body 

In all reality, that's the best argument you can make.

 

[Wrecker]

34 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

In all reality, that's the best argument you can make.

 

No, the unrelenting chime that goes off as soon as you hit ~20 km/h (dontfknknow mp/h) is the best argument.

DING DING DING DING DING.... DING DING DING DING DING.... DINGDINGDINGDINGDING... *flashing person with a seatbelt on light*

[Hikaru Okami]

Seatbelts never helped motorcyclists. They're useless! Drivers should wear helmets because they save lives.

[WileyWarWeasel]

1 hour ago, Hikaru Okami said:

Seatbelts never helped motorcyclists. They're useless! Drivers should wear helmets because they save lives.

That is preposterous. Drivers should wear parachutes and diving suits because they save lives!

[#00Buck]

Seat belts are trash. They only go across the lap and one shoulder. 

They should be replaced by 5 point harnesses. 

Then you could eliminate costly and dangerous airbags from all cars making them less expensive and far safer. 

[Gamedog]

7 minutes ago, #00Buck said:

Seat belts are trash. They only go across the lap and one shoulder. 

They should be replaced by 5 point harnesses. 

Then you could eliminate costly and dangerous airbags from all cars making them less expensive and far safer. 

considering its your head that goes forward and hits the airbag, we should use NeckBelts.

[Spot]

4 minutes ago, #00Buck said:

Seat belts are trash. They only go across the lap and one shoulder. 

They should be replaced by 5 point harnesses. 

Then you could eliminate costly and dangerous airbags from all cars making them less expensive and far safer. 

True, all cars should come with roll cages, too! 

[#00Buck]

Just now, Gamedog said:

considering its your head that goes forward and hits the airbag, we should use NeckBelts.

There is such a thing used in racing and it prevents spinal injuries. 

Just now, Mr. Fox said:

True, all cars should come with roll cages, too! 

And a ZZ4 crate motor with a nitrous system. 

[Spot]

Just now, #00Buck said:

And a ZZ4 crate motor with a nitrous system. 

Now we're talking!

[#00Buck]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Now we're talking!

All cars should constantly play ZZ Top's Eliminator album at 200 decibels all the time even when the car is shut off and nobody is driving it. 

[Endless/Nameless]

Just now, #00Buck said:

All cars should constantly play ZZ Top's Eliminator album at 200 decibels all the time even when the car is shut off and nobody is driving it. 

Cuz every girls crazy 'bout a 6-point belt

[Gamedog]

9 minutes ago, #00Buck said:

There is such a thing used in racing and it prevents spinal injuries. 

we neednonly neck belts in car

[#00Buck]

Legs.

 

 

[Spot]

2 minutes ago, #00Buck said:

All cars should constantly play ZZ Top's Eliminator album at 200 decibels all the time even when the car is shut off and nobody is driving it. 

Gimme all your lovin
All your hugs and kisses too
Gimme all your lovin
Don't let up until we're through

[Endless/Nameless]

1 minute ago, #00Buck said:

[super awesome video]

She's got a neckbelt!

And she knows how to use it!

[ArielMT]

If you head-on, rear-end, or T-bone my car, the last thing I want compounding that disaster is your lifeless body hurtling through what's left of my car like an unguided missile because you were too lazy to strap in.

Edited March 20, 2016 by ArielMT

[Endless/Nameless]

Just now, ArielMT said:

If you head-on, rear-end, or T-bone my car, the last thing I want compounding that disaster is your lifeless body hurling through what's left of my car like an unguided missile because you were too lazy to strap in.

IT'S NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS IF I IDENTIFY AS AN UNGUIDED MISSLE DONT MOCK MY DREAMS CHECK YOUR PRILVILEGEDE

[DevilBear]

I support seat belt laws.

Do I ever wear my seat belt? Well, nothing is illegal until you get caught :3

[ArielMT]

3 minutes ago, Endless/Nameless said:

IT'S NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS IF I IDENTIFY AS AN UNGUIDED MISSLE DONT MOCK MY DREAMS CHECK YOUR PRILVILEGEDE

Is there a fandom for those who identify as extremely low earth orbit projectiles?

[Endless/Nameless]

Just now, ArielMT said:

Is there a fandom for those who identify as extremely low earth orbit projectiles?

We're called..........NUKEIEES

1 minute ago, DevilBear said:

nothing is illegal until you get caught :3

:3c

[PastryOfApathy]

1 minute ago, ArielMT said:

Is there a fandom for those who identify as extremely low earth orbit projectiles?

Well where there's a will, there's a tumblr blog.

Edited March 20, 2016 by PastryOfApathy

[Joel]

 

 

[PheagleAdler]

The laws exist because of ignorant people who would otherwise not do the right thing, maybe they'd be the kinds of people eligible for a Darwin Award.